About reed quality

[Vero]

Hello everyone, I am in the market selecting an accordion and I hope you can share some knowledge about reeds.

While browsing through the catalogs of different accordion brands, I noticed the section on reed quality. Some are marked as SD, some as H, and others as TAM (which I guess means Tipo A Mano) or A plus, etc. I would like to know the meanings of these abbreviations and how they rank in terms of quality.

Do these abbreviations represent quality rather than brand? Eg. reeds of Durall/superdurall is a brand or a class of quality? Is the quality of reeds of the same grade similar across different brands? Which brand or grade of reeds should we prioritize in our selection? Any insights would be apprieciated.

 

[debra]

There is more to learn about reeds (and reed quality) than a simple person like me can comprehend... but I know a few things at least.
Hohner used to make at least three different types of reeds: H, T and Artiste. I believe that H reeds were the lower end, T were a bit peculiar because they had a trapezoidal shape with a rectangular separator between the reeds, so the reeds look like they come closer together near the tip. T reeds were used for instance in the Atlantic series. Artiste reeds were the better reeds, used for instance in the Atlantic "de luxe" models and in early Morino accordions, on the treble side only.
SD is an abbreviation of Super Dural, and indicates machine-made Italian reeds. Good SD reeds are actually not bad at all, but have a bit more tolerance between the sizes of the holes in the reed plates and the reed tongues. By having a slightly wider gap these reeds use (actually waste) more air than the more expensive reed types. You mostly notice this on the first notes that are high enough to no longer have valves. (Typically notes around C6 or D6).
TAM stands for Tipo a Mano and their reed tongues are stamped out of sheets of steel by a machine. The reed tongues are the same type of steel and the same size as the A Mano reeds, which are cut out of a narrow band of steel. The length of the a mano reed tongue follows the direction of the band of steel. The tipo a mano reeds are cut perpendicular to the direction of the (wide) roll of steel. (That direction may have a slight influence on the sound and durability of the reeds.) Tipo a mano and a mano reeds are "finished" by hand.
People sometimes discuss which type of reed is "better". The reality is that the quality of tipo a mano and a mano reeds depends a lot on the manual labor of putting reed tongues and reed plates together and hammering in the rivets. If the rivets are hit too hard (and/or many times) the reed plate may deform and if they are not hit enough then years later the reed tongue may not hold 100% and the frequency may become less stable... While Super Dural reeds have a bit less potential for top quality their production process, being fully mechanized, is better controlled. As a result I expect fewer differences between different Super Dural reeds from the same or different manufacturers, whereas there are differences in the tam and a mano reeds that cause people to prefer one brand over another.

 

[Thomas N]

There is more to learn about reeds (and reed quality) than a simple person like me can comprehend... but I know a few things at least.
Hohner used to make at least three different types of reeds: H, T and Artiste. I believe that H reeds were the lower end, T were a bit peculiar because they had a trapezoidal shape with a rectangular separator between the reeds, so the reeds look like they come closer together near the tip. T reeds were used for instance in the Atlantic series. Artiste reeds were the better reeds, used for instance in the Atlantic "de luxe" models and in early Morino accordions, on the treble side only.
SD is an abbreviation of Super Dural, and indicates machine-made Italian reeds. Good SD reeds are actually not bad at all, but have a bit more tolerance between the sizes of the holes in the reed plates and the reed tongues. By having a slightly wider gap these reeds use (actually waste) more air than the more expensive reed types. You mostly notice this on the first notes that are high enough to no longer have valves. (Typically notes around C6 or D6.
TAM stands for Tipo a Mano and their reed tongues are stamped out of sheets of steel by a machine. The reed tongues are the same type of steel and the same size as the A Mano reeds, which are cut out of a narrow band of steel. The length of the a mano reed tongue follows the direction of the band of steel. The tipo a mano reeds are cut perpendicular to the direction of the (wide) roll of steel. (That direction may have a slight influence on the sound and durability of the reeds.) Tipo a mano and a mano reeds are "finished" by hand.
People sometimes discuss which type of reed is "better". The reality is that the quality of tipo a mano and a mano reeds depends a lot on the manual labor of putting reed tongues and reed plates together and hammering in the rivets. If the rivets are hit too hard (and/or many times) the reed plate may deform and if they are not hit enough then years later the reed tongue may not hold 100% and the frequency may become less stable... While Super Dural reeds have a bit less potential for top quality their production process, being fully mechanized, is better controlled. As a result I expect fewer differences between different Super Dural reeds from the same or different manufacturers, whereas there are differences in the tam and a mano reeds that cause people to prefer one brand over another.

That was an excellent primer succinctly summed up in a couple paragraphs Paul! Thanks!

 

[Vero]

There is more to learn about reeds (and reed quality) than a simple person like me can comprehend... but I know a few things at least.
Hohner used to make at least three different types of reeds: H, T and Artiste. I believe that H reeds were the lower end, T were a bit peculiar because they had a trapezoidal shape with a rectangular separator between the reeds, so the reeds look like they come closer together near the tip. T reeds were used for instance in the Atlantic series. Artiste reeds were the better reeds, used for instance in the Atlantic "de luxe" models and in early Morino accordions, on the treble side only.
SD is an abbreviation of Super Dural, and indicates machine-made Italian reeds. Good SD reeds are actually not bad at all, but have a bit more tolerance between the sizes of the holes in the reed plates and the reed tongues. By having a slightly wider gap these reeds use (actually waste) more air than the more expensive reed types. You mostly notice this on the first notes that are high enough to no longer have valves. (Typically notes around C6 or D6).
TAM stands for Tipo a Mano and their reed tongues are stamped out of sheets of steel by a machine. The reed tongues are the same type of steel and the same size as the A Mano reeds, which are cut out of a narrow band of steel. The length of the a mano reed tongue follows the direction of the band of steel. The tipo a mano reeds are cut perpendicular to the direction of the (wide) roll of steel. (That direction may have a slight influence on the sound and durability of the reeds.) Tipo a mano and a mano reeds are "finished" by hand.
People sometimes discuss which type of reed is "better". The reality is that the quality of tipo a mano and a mano reeds depends a lot on the manual labor of putting reed tongues and reed plates together and hammering in the rivets. If the rivets are hit too hard (and/or many times) the reed plate may deform and if they are not hit enough then years later the reed tongue may not hold 100% and the frequency may become less stable... While Super Dural reeds have a bit less potential for top quality their production process, being fully mechanized, is better controlled. As a result I expect fewer differences between different Super Dural reeds from the same or different manufacturers, whereas there are differences in the tam and a mano reeds that cause people to prefer one brand over another.

Wow, thanks for the answer. You're like an accordion encyclopaedia！

 

[John Doe]

Truly a great executive summary on a fraught subject.

The bottom line for any purchaser though is to listen to how an instrument actually sounds. While it's unlikely that a set of reeds made in a Karachi suburb out of tin cans is going to be anything other than abysmal, it's quite possible that no name machine reeds may sound just as good or better than poorly implemented hand crafted reeds made of unobtanium. The end result is what counts and much of the information available at dealers and through web sites is heavily filtered through a miasma of advertising hoopla. "Sound samples" on a website are no better than the end speakers on your phone or computer and a decent sound engineer can mike up anything to sound superb.

A lot of mechanical musical components do not age all that gracefully for any instrument- though well cared for items which were great when new will still probably be ...great- though probably in need of fine tuning/voicing to reestablish that greatness. There are clearly once superb instruments which have great nostalgia value but which are no longer the shining beacons of excellence they once were- even with extensive (and probably very pricey) work.

The only caveat is that resale, in the fullness of time should you do so, will be affected by the perceived value as represented by the aforementioned hoopla and that will be pretty much independant of how it sounds.

 

[Vero]

Truly a great executive summary on a fraught subject.

The bottom line for any purchaser though is to listen to how an instrument actually sounds. While it's unlikely that a set of reeds made in a Karachi suburb out of tin cans is going to be anything other than abysmal, it's quite possible that no name machine reeds may sound just as good or better than poorly implemented hand crafted reeds made of unobtanium. The end result is what counts and much of the information available at dealers and through web sites is heavily filtered through a miasma of advertising hoopla. "Sound samples" on a website are no better than the end speakers on your phone or computer and a decent sound engineer can mike up anything to sound superb.

A lot of mechanical musical components do not age all that gracefully for any instrument- though well cared for items which were great when new will still probably be ...great- though probably in need of fine tuning/voicing to reestablish that greatness. There are clearly once superb instruments which have great nostalgia value but which are no longer the shining beacons of excellence they once were- even with extensive (and probably very pricey) work.

The only caveat is that resale, in the fullness of time should you do so, will be affected by the perceived value as represented by the aforementioned hoopla and that will be pretty much independant of how it sounds.

Thanks for your detailed response! It’s a great reminder to focus on the end result rather than just the brand or the hype. What my ears like, is the best reed, I guess.