How do I get 72 bass buttons into their correct holes?

[Jack Humphreys]

While attempting a repair, I removed the 72 hole-board, and then had 72 buttons dangling randomly from their push-rods. I have sorted them into their 6 rows, separated by strips of card. But it's a nightmare trying to replace the hole-board, while keeping each button in its right place. Please Help! Can someone advise the best way to do this? I'd be most grateful. (Jack, newcomer from Bristol, UK)

 

[colinm]

I think you need to post a photo of the current state of the bass end.

 

[John Doe]

Second the request for a picture- most of my accordions do not really offer a way to pull the button board without major effort so I'm not sure exactly what you have going on.

Assuming that the pushrods, which you have separated into rows, are still held in at the bottom end I'd think the best way to approach it would be to invert the bass end so that the push rods and buttons are dangling. Use a knitting hook tool (or similar, I use a woodwind spring hook tool simply because I'm awash in the things) and reach in and gently guide the buttons into the holes starting with the back row. You want the hole board so that the buttons will be held in when you maneuver them into position by some small amount of tension, but probably not such that you have to fully depress them to get them into place.

I'd go lengthwise (12 button) row by row in this endeavor from the counterbass to the diminished row.

Once they're all in place, carefully position the board into its final position. Easier said than done. you may well have cause to resort to colorful language as a slight miscue with the hole board may allow several "in position" buttons to gang aglee requiring a bit of a redo. Such is life- it'll go faster with each iteration.

If the push rods are going to fall out of the machine when you invert it DON"T DO IT; a pile of tangled bass machine piston rods is really really painful to sort. If that's the case you can accomplish this pushing them into place from under the board but it'll be a bit more annoying as the buttons not yet in the holes will want to flop over as you work.

Good luck-

Henry

 

[murathan]

Best way is to get them done at repair shop.

 

[John Doe]

Best way is to get them done at repair shop.

Dissassembling chunks of the bass casing/mechanism surely seems to fit right in that category unless you are treating the instrument as something to learn repairs on.

In this case though, I figured the horse had already left the barn. It's taken apart and the gentleman who did so seems to be relatively competent mechanically- at least he sorted the bass pistons into organized groups as they sit. At this point reassembly is probably more tedious than dangerous.

And the reception he'd get at the average repair shop lugging in an accordion in the condition he now has would be...

Nice instrument? Take the flak from the repair guy and take it in. A beater- drive on and fix it yourself. Get that "pride of ownership..."

 

[Jack Humphreys]

Thanks very much Henry D. My first post here, and an immediate helpful reply!
Following advice on another forum, I did try inverting, letting the buttons dangle downward on their push rods. But they did so in a random fashion, all jumbled up. I couldn't see how to identify which should go where.
Returning to right-way-up I went back to trying to sort buttons into rows, right-side-up, but then I couldn't get them into the hole-board. After hours of failure, I got so incredibly frustrated with this. I couldn't stand it any longer, and phoned up my repairer.
A total nightmare. A few years go I built my own 14 bass diato box on a course, and this gave me false confidence about tackling the ridiculously complex Stradella bass end. It's a different world. Murathan was right!

 

[murathan]

Dissassembling chunks of the bass casing/mechanism surely seems to fit right in that category unless you are treating the instrument as something to learn repairs on.

In this case though, I figured the horse had already left the barn. It's taken apart and the gentleman who did so seems to be relatively competent mechanically- at least he sorted the bass pistons into organized groups as they sit. At this point reassembly is probably more tedious than dangerous.

And the reception he'd get at the average repair shop lugging in an accordion in the condition he now has would be...

Nice instrument? Take the flak from the repair guy and take it in. A beater- drive on and fix it yourself. Get that "pride of ownership..."

As I know, these must have been numbered while opening. They got mixed now. It became a puzzle...

 

[boxplayer4000]

Jack Humphreys:
You've already learned a lesson in your path to home repairs of anything, including accordions, ie. don't interfere with it unless you can see your way back.
You have several repair people in your neck of the woods. Relocating the buttons is a small job (mostly) to experienced repairers so 'rip-off' estimates should not be accepted.
Should you want to continue along the path of doing the job yourself start from the position that 'the keyboard came out so it must be possible to replace it' in a reverse order procedure.
You've not given any photographs to help us but a general rule is that the inside, diminished 7th row of buttons get entered first. A few home-made wire hooks etc. to help locate the buttons is a help.

 

[Ffingers]

Jack Humphreys:
You've already learned a lesson in your path to home repairs of anything, including accordions, ie. don't interfere with it unless you can see your way back.
You have several repair people in your neck of the woods. Relocating the buttons is a small job (mostly) to experienced repairers so 'rip-off' estimates should not be accepted.
Should you want to continue along the path of doing the job yourself start from the position that 'the keyboard came out so it must be possible to replace it' in a reverse order procedure.
You've not given any photographs to help us but a general rule is that the inside, diminished 7th row of buttons get entered first. A few home-made wire hooks etc. to help locate the buttons is a help.

I'm in Australia and have lived a rural life for much of that time and grown accostomed to the problems of time, distance and simple unavailability of 'services'.
Improvisation becomes a must, as most farmers will tell you, as they offer up a selection of guages of rolled wire, pliers and a couple of hammers as the most immediate tools for a multitude of tasks.
Spanners and socket sets, inadvertently left in the paddock in wet conditions are often not immediately locatable

 

[John Doe]

You've not given any photographs to help us but a general rule is that the inside, diminished 7th row of buttons get entered first.

Goes to show that there's more than one way to skin a cat. For novice accordion owners/tinkerers as well as for the unfortunate cats, the results are frequently a bit unpleasant. One learns from mistakes- but you've got to try to limit what the possible bad results are. Jumping off the one story garage with an umbrella for a parachute is foolish- but depending on the garage merely unsettling (did it as a wayward youth). Jumping off a three story roof with an umbrella for a parachute was not something I attempted (though I did briefly envision it!); I had no interest in broken legs...

When I replace bass pistons in the bass machine I always do the back (counterbass) row first. For me, the waving ranks of the other bass and chord rods in front make it too difficult for me to accurately access the back rank. Just so, when I dissassemble- on those infrequent and always tediously and painstakingly unpleasant occasions when I do so (say what you will about removable bass machines, if all you need to do is pallet work they are a godsend)- I always start in the front with the diminshed row.

Boxplayer clearly has an opposite take- and probably achieves excellent results with it.

There are limits to what comes across as repair assistance via chatboard typing!

For Mr. H- going to the repair guy probably a wise choice. The bass rods really are not all that easily ID'd without a lot of experience with them. Even then, they are- at least for me- a real collosal pain to sort out once mixed up. Truly- close gets you no cigar.

 

[John Doe]

Improvisation becomes a must, as most farmers will tell you, as they offer up a selection of guages of rolled wire, pliers and a couple of hammers as the most immediate tools for a multitude of tasks.

Necessity- or in this case severe inconvenience- is the mother of invention.

 

[KiwiSqueezer]

Without a picture of the puzzle, we're likely to make unhelpful suggestions, however...

Suggestions to take it to a repairer are defeatist! OK, not all of us revel in this sort of mechanical puzzle, but really, no particular skill is required.

If you've got the buttons collated into rows, and in the right order along each row, is the problem simply(!) stuffing them through the holes? In other words, no sorting or identification required? One suggestion: stick the rods of each row to the cardboard strip you've already fashioned, with adhesive tape, so they form straight, correctly-spaced rows ('plates' if you like), then you only need three hands to wiggle the entire row around. Hopefully, the 'hole plate' can be tilted so you can fit one row at a time. BluTac or Plasicene (spelling?) are useful as temporary restraints.

Second suggestion is to dismantle the entire mechanism. It's not difficult, just tedious, and you need to invent your own mental-lapse-proof method of holding the removed components in their correct order. Label everything, take notes, photograph! Then re-build one rod at a time, starting with the counter-bass row (how can you do it any other way?). Hopefully, you'll find it easier than you think. I've worked on a mid-sized, 120 bass box, in which some of the counter-bass and bass buttons just wouldn't go in, without temporarily removing several 'pipes'. I don't think that's 'normal', but a side-effect of the small size. It was a fiddle, but patience won, in the end.

And for your next accordion, get one with a removable bass machine!

 

[32251]

If I have to repair say a broken wood support on the bass side and I have to remove the four chord section I always do this. The two bass rows are usually still installed. Now check that all the tine shafts are in the correct slots and all the tines move freely and all the rods that open the pallets are in the correct linkage orientation. There is usually a wooden strip that retains the first two rows of button rods. Take that strip off and one at a time remove all the dim and 7 chord button rods and number them. Now you only have to insert between the tines the maj and min chord button rods. Then one at a time insert the dim and 7th rods. As you insert the rods, you will see a pattern of reassembly. Dim=row 1 7th= row 2. Min = row 3. Maj = row 4. So 1-3 button rods and then 2-4 button rods and check that the tines are under the push pins…..then keep inserting the button rods. I stopped trying to line up and install all 4 rows at the same time. Much easier to do like this. Also don’t screw in the lock screws into the chord row holder till you get all the buttons in. You can move the assembly from side to side when needed during the install.