Improvisation on the Box

[Waldo]

I'm starting a new splinter thread from "Learning to Play by Ear". Hopefully we can keep the subject matter focused on the "How to", & "Tips to", in order to accomplish this end.

IMPROVISATION: Noun; Tempory expediant, extemporisation, creation, performance.

These are all synonyms for the term, improvisation. To me, and for the subject matter of the thread, improvisation mainly refers to the skill of being able to "compose" on the fly. Ex: You're playing along with the band and there is a bar or two after the singer has completed her lyrics, but before the next phrase begins. You fill in those two bars with a "riff" or "ditty" that dosen't appear on the sheet, but creates a wonderful adjunct to the song. Next time around it may be something completely different. Often, these fills are only a single note, a 3 or 4 note scale run or something more elaborate.
Geo G mentioned in the "By Ear" thread that he "dislikes" the term "improvisation", preferring "arrangement" instead, and I see where both terms fit, as arrangement means organization or placement. I will, however, not use the term because it also conjers up "a musical arrangement" [one of the definations in my dictionary], suggesting printed or copyrighted material, a confusion which I wish to avoid. [No slight, George, I have immense respect for your knowledge and hope you will contribute to this thread].

What I'm seeking here, are tips, "rules", ideas, techniques or other input, in order to develop "improvisation" as a skill. I will begin by listing several techniques that have helped me so far.

1) SCALES! Dang it, they're back. The best thing I have found, so far, is to play scales. I start out by playing sequential notes, say in the C scale [BUT, visit all 12 scales], up and down the complete keyboard [a scale dosen't necessarily end at the next octive]. Once I'm warmed up, I begin to vary the order of the notes in the scale. I may skip every other note and run up and down several times with this pattern, then skip two notes, then three. Then back to the full scale, then jump up 4-5 notes for a quick twiddle, followed by a chromatic scale decent back to the root, then three notes of the scale with a jump up to the next octave, corresponding note, and finish the run, then a glissando back down to the root, and so on, for hours. I never really know where I going next, other than to stay within the scale.
The end result has been impressive [for me, anyway], in that I find I can create short [4-6 bar] ditties that actually sound pretty good [there is plenty of terrible stuff, too]. I am also developing the ability to play a tune I already know and deviate from the score with a bar or two that actually sound like they fit. I don't always "hear" these deviations in my head before making them, they just seem to happen.

2) LEARN tunes by EAR; I started out learning by ear [no tutor], which meant "hunt and peck", while I sussed out the tune. I think this H&P gave me some kind of "pitch orientation" to the plethora of buttons on the treble side. While I H&P much less than I used to, the experience was useful.

3) ACCIDENTALS: [My current challange] While tunes are composed in a Key, or Keys, accidentals [pitches outside the Key] are still a part if the "Big Key" picture. By that I mean, any pitch can be incorporated in any tune, as long as it's resolved [See: Jazz]. When scooting around the scales [see #1, above], I'll sometimes hit an accidental by accident [????], which used to bug me. I am now trying to just continue on and resolve the tonal dissonance with the following pitches. I'm finding this to be quite difficult, as I usually have to H&P for the resolution, which stops the tune, I get lost and lose the continuity of the melody. Is there a rule for resolving accidentals?

4) PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE: I know, I know.

Waldo

 

[donn]

Well, it's all more or less the same thing, but improvisation happens in several different contexts in music. You might take a whole chorus, ideally with the intent to show off your virtuosity and also create something of musical value, you might just improvise in the background (bass for example), or a short run as described above that's foreground but not a featured solo, or in a solo performance you might play parts a little different each time through. Usually in any case, to some predetermined "chord sequence."

I have neither experience nor training in musical pedagogy, but if someone needed my help getting started with improvisation, I suppose I'd recommend whistling. Or humming, etc., whatever works for you. If you can just as easily play a tune by ear on the accordion as whistle it, then fine, we can start on the accordion if you like, but I think this is rarely the case with people who aren't comfortable improvising. Whistle a tune until it gets boring, and then start playing around with it, with the understanding that you may make a lot of very wretched music, but you're tough enough to survive this and come back for more. Meanwhile, learn to play stuff by ear on the accordion.

 

[george garside]

just a thought, there are some genres such as jazz that lend themselves very much towards improvisation around a fairly simple melody line. That is using the word 'improvisation' more or less as 'doing your own to fill gaps already provided in the basic tune'
There is on the other hand a sort of accidental type of improvisation that some use to fill in bits of a tune they cant, remember so as to maintain the correct number of beats is a bar etc. If repeated regularly this 'improvisation' becomes a ,sometimes good, sometimes crappy ''arrangement''

Then there is the situation where an individual takes a dislike to a bit of a tune , maybe a bar or two , maybe a couple of notes and deliberately changes them, for better or worse to something more to his/her liking! is this improvisation or arrangement?

then there are tunes 'composed' in the head and genuinely thought of as being ''original'' that later turn out to contain chunks large or small of an existing tune!

improvisation v arrangement is a minefield!

 

[george garside]

Another thought for the melting pot. What is the difference, if any, between 'improvisation' and 'ornementation''

george

 

[donn]

If this is about terminology ...
arrange: adapt basic tune to requirements (instruments, style, etc.), in advance.
improvise: create a tune or phrase, during performance.
ornament: substitute a note with a set of shorter notes centered around the pitch of the original note.

But when you just play a tune different from the way you've heard it, that's just "playing a tune." I don't know of a word for it, likely no one ever needed one.

 

[Nuuksu]

There are many improvisation tips and techniques, but not one and universal. Most popular is chord-scale method and second one is guide tone method.

Chord-scale method is based on matching chord with corresponding scale idea, for example scale for Dm7 chord is dorian mode, scale for G7 chord is mixolydian mode and scale for Cmaj7 is ionian mode. By the way Dm7-G7-Cmaj7 is very typical ii-V-I chord progression. Dorian, mixolydian and ionian modes are old church modes that are build from some degree from major scale. Ionian mode is built from first degree and is actually major scale, mixolydian mode is built from fifth degree and dorian mode is build from second degree. They can be build in every key.

Examples in C major
Ionia - Cmaj7 - C D E F G A B C
doria - Dm7 - D E F G A B C D
mixolydia - G7 - G A B C D E F G

Non-chord scale tones are solved into chord tones.

This may be little confusing at the beginning but actually there is only twelve keys and modes. Ionian - major and eolian - minor are most popular modes that are practiced as ordinary scales Harmonic and melodic minor scales are completely different scales actually - they are altered scales.

Wikipedia article about chord-scale method - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chord-scale_system

Guide tone method is simpler than chord-scale method. Main idea behind guide tone method is that non chord tones must be solved into chord tone at some point, still many sucessive non chord tones can be played. Chord tones are considered stable but non chord tones make tensions. But instead of scales full chromatic scale is used. I

Example Cmaj7 - C E G B are chord tones and D F A are not. If using this approach full chromatic scale can be used.

n practice both methods are used and mixed, chord-scale method is just simpler to analyze.

It is good idea to start with standard chord progressions, like ii-V-I and blues. After that more adcanced scales and modes can be studied. I recommend Jamey Aebersold play-along series - very good material for leaners. Familiarise yourself with sound of different modes and play them in all keys. Gary Dahl has published couple books about these topics.

http://www.melbay.com/Products/99762/master-accordion-scale-book.aspx

http://www.melbay.com/Products/97343M/chord-melody-method-for-accordion.aspx

This doesnt apply only for jazz improvisation, it can be used anywhere. At the end of day every player just need to develop his/her own improvisation methods and ideas

 

[rancoman]

I understood that right up to 'There are many improvisation tips and techniques,' then I got confused..... :b

 

[george garside]

Nuuksu's treatise on improvisation will, presumably, be meaningful to those on the forum who have a classical/theoretical background but will mean very little to by earists of which I am one .

If we must use the term 'improvisation' it is, to me, a spontaneous sort of adding extra notes/chords here and there to a tune as originally thought up/composed/written or whatever. Using a theoretical approach seems in some way to remove the spontaneity of the activity. But of course each to their own!

The earist will work entirely by choosing a combination of notes that provide the sound he/she wants on the basis of if it sounds right it is right. This ability is developed simply by experience and experimentation or as a brilliant professional box player once put it keep a tune note going while you prod around to find another that goes nicely with it, then keep the two playing and root round for a third etc etc. Same for finding bass. The more this is used the more intuitive it becomes and the easier it becomes to fit a bit of 'improvisation' into a veriety of tunes.
others may of course legitimately disagree in the interests of healthy debate

george

 

[Howie]

Nuuksus treatise on improvisation will, presumably, be meaningful to those on the forum who have a classical/theoretical background but will mean very little to by earists of which I am one .
...
The earist will work entirely by choosing a combination of notes that provide the sound he/she wants on the basis of if it sounds right it is right.
...
others may of course legitimately disagree in the interests of healthy debate

Can I agree with both of you? Both approaches are fine. Although being an earist doesnt have to exclude knowing some theory, which after all is a language to convey a message to musicians.

Theory sets out the bounds and structure of what is right, for want of a better description. For example Jazz players will drill scales (various modes) and arpeggios etc. until their ear and their fingers can conjure up the sound they want. Many of them study theory as a way of directing their practice. Theyre still excellent earists because they can hear a set of changes and tell you what they are, name a dozen standards that use those changes or similar, and immediately play music (improvising) that goes with those chords; all without consulting any sheet music; you can play a particular scale and they can tell you what it is. And then again some wouldnt know Ionian from Dorian from Phrygian but play just as well.

Theres nothing wrong with either approach, although arguments about what good improv is and how to do it have raged as long as musicians have pursued it. A study of theory can help a musician discover new ways of harmonizing and developing music spontaneously, and expand their boundaries. But if one mostly plays music that either doesnt call for three choruses of improvisation, or doesnt use complex modalities, then theres no pressing need to study or know theory in great depth.

So if I sit in with a Jazz group and when my turn comes I just play the melody with a couple ornamentations, I wont be invited back. Similarly if I play with a folk band and go all John Coltrane on them I probably wont be invited back either

Just the fact that we know the difference between major and minor chords, and we know how to play a scale - or, what notes belong in the key of what were playing, means we already know some theory.

Ive rambled a bit, sorry. Its an interesting topic.

 

[Nuuksu]

I probably should have been mention that chord-scale method is newer than jazz improvisation. At dixieland era they probably just tested and played what sounded good and probably used guide tones method. Simply play only chord tones or pentatonic scale with some blue notest and it sounds quite good.

Anyway as George an Howie mentioned this kind of theory is only for guidance. Aebersold mentioned his play-along vol. 1 that playing only theory makes player sound like well oiled jazz machine.

http://www.jazzbooks.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=JAJAZZ&Product_Code=V01DS

Also that is right that jazz players are actually earists, they just use thoery as guidance for explaining things.

 

[Anyanka]

... If we must use the term improvisation it is, to me, a spontaneous sort of adding extra notes/chords here and there to a tune as originally thought up/composed/written or whatever. ...

In my usage, improvisation goes a lot further than that - what you describe, George, is what I would call variation, which should be standard practice for any accomplished musician. Improvisation takes the tune further away from its origins than that, or departs from it altogether while staying in the same key & rhythm, or creates something out of nothing - in my opinion.

The diatonic accordion player Anne Niepold led some improv sessions at Halsway Manor, as part of the European Music weekend. In some, we were just asked to make spontaneous noises on our instruments in the dark, in others, you improvised in a particular key or over a particular chord structure.

For me, the easiest way to start improvising on the accordion is to pick a key and a rhythm (waltzes are particularly easy), play the obvious chords and start playing notes, right-hand chords or melodies over the top of that.

 

[george garside]

For me, the easiest way to start improvising on the accordion is to pick a key and a rhythm (waltzes are particularly easy), play the obvious chords and start playing notes, right-hand chords or melodies over the top of that.

I suppose I do that on the rare (says he!) occasions when I forget part of the tune, particularly when playing for dancers as you cant afford to grind to a halt. I agree that it is particularly easy with waltzes.

perhaps its just playing with words as I have never considered so doing to be improvisation rather as covering cock ups with a quick burst of busking

george </QUOTE>

 

[Howie]

Waldo, regarding accidentals - the interesting thing about them is that sometimes, if you repeat a phrase where you "accidentally inserted an accidental" it might not only sound like you meant it, but sound good! Heaps of tunes feature accidentals that are the very thing that make them great. So, speaking of scales, there are various bebop scales that add a particular accidental to a scale, as an extra note. Most often a bebop scale is played with a particular chord or chords in a progression. And despite the name, bebop scales don't have to be restricted to bebop or jazz.

It's true that learning scales, pentatonics, arpeggios etc is a good way to get some tools in the kit. And also true that if all we do is noodle around on a scale, we sound very samey and unimpressive. But, it's a good way to start. One of the things I learned for improv was don't always play to the chord of the moment - but to also play to the upcoming chord, to lead the listener's ear to what's coming next. Also, that what you don't play, the gaps and pauses, are just as important. Give the listener time to absorb that awesome accidental accidental.

As has been alluded to already our ears should dictate what sounds good, not someone's opinion of correct theory. So there's lots of practice needed to work out what works and what doesn't. Sonny Rollins at one time became discouraged with his playing and so he took time out from performing and spent three years of practicing in the most private place he could find - Williamsburg Bridge. He says he spent 15 hours every day practicing, no matter the weather.

There are a ton of youtube videos on improvising and ideas to practice. Of course 99.999% of them don't feature accordion, but most improvisation ideas apply across instruments. While improvisation seems to feature mostly in jazz, the techniques and theory that jazz players study can apply to other genres just as well.

 

[losthobos]

As you've probably noticed I'm a sucker for old melody based jazz tunes...these normally feature variations of the cycle if fifths....or the changes as some players call them...so ii, V I or VI, ii, V,I etc...so once I,ve these progressions under my fingers in a given key then I'll just ignore the melody and play around the changes....what is important is that you lead from one chord into the next...that essentially is the change...example the 3rd note of the ii chord is the 7th note of the V chord...the 3rd note of the V chord is the 7th of the 1 chord...etc all these tones are strong so should be used as leading and target tones...essential stuff if you want your playing to sound like it has direction....and probably needs to be played by ear but obviously musical knowledge/langauge makes it possible to share such ideas
There was a book called "Target and Approach tones" by Joe Riposa ..well worth buying if you want to really learn improvisation simply....hope that's helpful

 

[Howie]

what is important is that you lead from one chord into the next...that essentially is the change...example the 3rd note of the ii chord is the 7th note of the V chord...the 3rd note of the V chord is the 7th of the 1 chord...etc all these tones are strong so should be used as leading and target tones...essential stuff if you want your playing to sound like it has direction....

Nicely put losthobos. Right there is enough for lots of practice leading to great improvisation.

Some other books to look at are -
Barry Finnerty - The Serious Jazz Book both 1 and 2.
Mark Levine - The Jazz Theory Book (very Jazz oriented with transcriptions of famous improvs and solos to demonstrate concepts, but still worthwhile study)
Hal Crook - How to Improvise and Ready Aim Improvise

Amazon returns over 2,900 books for music improvisation as a search so its a pretty rich field.

At first glance a lot of theory books can seem overwhelming, but you can learn much by practicing just a few pages of what Crook writes about leading tones, approach notes etc, for a while. Or no doubt losthobos suggestion of Joe Riposas book, which I havent read.

Youll see a lot of debate between proponents of different authors and whether their books are as good as a competitors. Best to use amazon or similar to look inside a book to see if the writing and topics covered appeal to you. We all learn differently and respond to ways of teaching and explaining differently.

On youtube I like Jeff Schneider. Aimed at sax players, the techniques and little building blocks he covers work for any instrument. And of course videos aimed at piano improv are going to transfer to accordion (both PA and button).

 

[george garside]

. Also, that what you dont play, the gaps and pauses, are just as important. Give the listener time to absorb that awesome accidental accidental.

.

.

playing the gaps is not only important but is vital.

The well known concert pianist Artur Schnabel put it this way The notes I handle no better than many pianists, but the pauses between the notes - Ah, that is where the art resides

Sir Jimmy Shand simply refered to it as playing long and short notes

george

 

[losthobos]

i mentioned the Joe Riposo book in particular as it goes through the changes (cycle of fifths) repeatedly....1st time say 3rd to seventh, then approaching from tone above, then from semitone below, then chromatically 3 notes...etc etc so you have loads of permutations of the same changes....then you can ad lib as you please.....and all for less than a tenner...
simple instructions , with notation rather than a thousand examples with no idea as to placement...

 

[Waldo]

I knew this thread would produce some useful information. Outside of the semantical debate [more later], there were several "Tips & Tricks" described that are just what I was fishing for.
In more or less order:
Nuuksu;
Would your nick named " treatise" distill down to: "Solo a/the mode over the chord progression"?
Geo.G;
"If we must use the term 'improvisation' it is, to me, a spontaneous sort of adding extra notes/chords here and there to a tune as originally thought up/composed/written or whatever. Using a theoretical approach seems in some way to remove the spontaneity of the activity. But of course each to their own!"
Another good description of what I was referring to. Losthobos used the term "Ad Lib", and maybe that would be a better term, here, in order to differentiate from the already used term "improvisation".
I have already noticed a blending of the several "genres" of "improvisation" in this discussion.
With respect to Theory and Improv being at odds, are there not guidelines from theory that a beginner can use to understand/improve? The Circle of 5ths being an example. Understanding the Cof5th quickly took me down a path I would outherwise have had to discover. This knowledge also helped me to understand the "Why" of the CBA-C layout [I still don't get "B"]. What I mean, here, is guideline versus structure [such as is found in classical].
Howie;
"Play to up coming chord"
I like that one & I'll work on it
"Gaps and pauses"
I once went to see a 15 year blues guitar phenom, and he could light a fretboard on fire, but he never stopped! Every bar had 32 notes in it, different notes, but zero pauses, not even a 32ed. We left during the third song. It just didn't sound good. No soul.
I always try to insert nothing whenever I can.
Where can I find these BeBop Scales ?
Losthobos;
I'll start looking for the Riposa book. In the mean time, can you elaborate on "leading from one chord to the next chord". Do you mean like running a scale between chords to connect them?

I mentioned in the opening post that I have been practicing scales "randomly", and a lot has come from that practice. Really, just poking around whiles't staying within [mostly] the scale. I have found a number of pleasant "riffs", although I have no Idea how to inject them into a tune, or remember them tomorrow. Hopefully, that skill will emerge from the morass.

Cool stuff, and very helpful.
Thanks to all posters
Waldo

 

[Howie]

Gaps and pauses
I once went to see a 15 year blues guitar phenom, and he could light a fretboard on fire, but he never stopped! Every bar had 32 notes in it, different notes, but zero pauses, not even a 32ed. We left during the third song. It just didnt sound good. No soul.
I always try to insert nothing whenever I can.
Where can I find these BeBop Scales ?

Exactly! its one thing to be a note-spitting-machine, another to be musical.

Bebop scales: most theory books aimed at improvisation cover them in depth, but it turns out that the wiki entry on them is a good introduction:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bebop_scale

There are lots of youtube videos on improvisation and bebop scales come up pretty often.

Anyhow, your randomly poking around in a scale, as you call it, is excellent practice for getting into improvisation.

 

[losthobos]

I mean the same as Howie when he says playing up to or into the next chord....I'm a beginner so I can't really be trusted to explain exactly...you're on the right path by asking....experience will teach you the rest...if I can think of a quick way to explain I will...if not youtube has great teachers ... I'm finding pianist Kent Hewitt a wonderful resource at moment....and Julian Bradley was also good for me for a while...best wishes