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Newbie: Looking for a very lightweight accordian

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sebwin

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Hello,

I play the diatonic Accordian/melodeon, but my partner (previously played piano) wants to start learning the piano Accordian (which I know nothing about!)

They’re playing a (what looks to me) large Dino baffeti piano Accordian with 26 piano keys (white and black) and 48 bass buttons.

It looks a bit like this except there are obviously fewer basses and only 2 “voice” switches


An issue with practicing is, unlike my melodeons, it’s very heavy, which is acting as a barrier to just “picking it up” and doing little bits of practice.

I realise in the world of accordians it probably isn’t that heavy, but I’m trying to find a much smaller/lighter one and wondering if anyone could give me any ideas (we’re in the Uk)

The music will primarily be English/Irish trad (so 2 octaves and few basses (won’t need augmented ones etc etc)) and Christmas carols.

Does anyone kindly have any ideas?

Thanks for your time
 
Tricky! My experience is that while an awful lot of folk music can be played with a small number of chords, Christmas carols can be quite elaborate. My small accordion is a Weltmeister Perle 48 and exactly the same weight as your partner's instrument - it is frustrating that it lacks a Bm bass button, but then it is half the weight of my 72 bass Hohner which does have it.

This old topic might be useful - it contains the weights of some smaller instruments -

8 bass and 12 bass piano accordions

Im looking for the exact netto weight of some lightweight accordions. Some of these have the low G note as a starter note, making them interesting for busking. Exact information about the net weight of these accordions seems to be missing, or at least confusing. Id rather see some figures in kg...
www.accordionists.info
 
Rosie C said:
Tricky! My experience is that while an awful lot of folk music can be played with a small number of chords, Christmas carols can be quite elaborate. My small accordion is a Weltmeister Perle 48 and exactly the same weight as your partner's instrument - it is frustrating that it lacks a Bm bass button, but then it is half the weight of my 72 bass Hohner which does have it.

This old topic might be useful - it contains the weights of some smaller instruments -

8 bass and 12 bass piano accordions

Im looking for the exact netto weight of some lightweight accordions. Some of these have the low G note as a starter note, making them interesting for busking. Exact information about the net weight of these accordions seems to be missing, or at least confusing. Id rather see some figures in kg...
www.accordionists.info
Click to expand...
That thread is perfect, that’s exactly what I’m looking for Thankyou!!

(The trad would be higher in importance than the Xmas carols actually, so that should be ok, thankyou)
 
sebwin said:
Hello,

I play the diatonic Accordian/melodeon, but my partner (previously played piano) wants to start learning the piano Accordian (which I know nothing about!)

They’re playing a (what looks to me) large Dino baffeti piano Accordian with 26 piano keys (white and black) and 48 bass buttons.

It looks a bit like this except there are obviously fewer basses and only 2 “voice” switches


An issue with practicing is, unlike my melodeons, it’s very heavy, which is acting as a barrier to just “picking it up” and doing little bits of practice.

I realise in the world of accordians it probably isn’t that heavy, but I’m trying to find a much smaller/lighter one and wondering if anyone could give me any ideas (we’re in the Uk)

The music will primarily be English/Irish trad (so 2 octaves and few basses (won’t need augmented ones etc etc)) and Christmas carols.

Does anyone kindly have any ideas?

Thanks for your time
Click to expand...
26 keys are small instruments. Range is limited to a degree where you cannot depend on even just the melody of a simple singable song fitting the keyboard in every key, so the "can play in any key" advantage of a chromatic instrument is pared down. Within that category of minimum-size instruments, the weight variations are not all that large. If you consider any of that instrument class as "very heavy", chances are that it is the wrong instrument to pick.

Chromatic accordions are heavy. Pretty much all of them outweigh a cello, and most larger ones outweigh a double bass. One thing you have to be aware of is that they are generally played while sitting down. That puts the weight into a different context. In show situations, you try at least to put the left foot up to get more of a supporting stance. There are some comparatively complex (and expensive) strap solutions for people playing in a walking band.
 
I have a LMM 72 bass Hohner Concenrto III with 2 bass switches that weights only 15 pounds, that's pretty light for the range it has.
 
dak said:
Chromatic accordions are heavy.
Click to expand...
MOST chromatic accordions are heavy, but not all. I play a 3-row MM CBA with a 36 note range and a chromatic bass that covers all 12 keys. It weighs 4 Kg or 9 lbs. and is the same size as a 3-row diatonic. The secret is the more compact chromatic button keyboard and a 24-button open-chord Darwin bass, that is smaller and lighter than a Stradella. It is not for everyone or every type of music, but it is great for folk music.

I mention this because I think few accordionists are aware that these exist. They are a special order from a few small builders. You can approach this size and weight with a small piano accordion, but it will not have a three-octave range or have bass buttons for all of the keys.

Now if you don't already play CBA, and want the smallest and lightest accordion, then you should also consider learning diatonic.
 
If you consider an accordion with 26 treble keys and 48 bass buttons and weighing 5,5kg large and heavy then you might want to consider a different instrument because to most accordion players what you have is tiny and a featherweight. A "standard" piano accordion has 41 treble keys and 120 bass buttons (and 4 voices) and typically weighs 11 to 12kg. There are some lightweight accordions around 10kg but they tend to be expensive. For me even such an accordion is "small". My full size button accordion has 64 treble notes and 120 bass buttons with convertor for 58 notes of melody bass. Such accordions come in around 16kg. I make accordion arrangements and often struggle to make an arrangement fit within 41 treble notes. 26 is just hopeless. Young children often start with 26 keys and fairly quickly move on to something larger (and heavier).
 
SteveBox said:
MOST chromatic accordions are heavy, but not all. I play a 3-row MM CBA with a 36 note range and a chromatic bass that covers all 12 keys. It weighs 4 Kg or 9 lbs. and is the same size as a 3-row diatonic.
Click to expand...
A cello is a large instrument and weighs 5 to 7 lbs.

Common melody instruments (violin, flute) weigh less than 2lb. A two-row melodeon clocks in below 6lb, already heavier than an alto sax.

You really have to view things in proportion. Of course, a piano will be heavier.
 
dak said:
A cello is a large instrument and weighs 5 to 7 lbs.
Click to expand...
A cello is mostly hollow inside. Remove all of the reeds from inside an accordion, and you will also have a light instrument. :)

More seriously, accordions should be compared to other polyphonic keyboard instruments.
 
Last edited:
SteveBox said:
A cello is mostly hollow inside. Remove all of the reeds from inside an accordion, and you will also have a light instrument. :)

More seriously, accordions should be compared to other polyphonic keyboard instruments.
Click to expand...
It seems pretty pointless to view the weight of accordions in relation to instruments that are not held up by the player. I don't think this thread is about transportation.
 
dak said:
It seems pretty pointless to view the weight of accordions in relation to instruments that are not held up by the player.
Click to expand...
You are right. So many ways to look at it. Every instrument has it's pros and cons. For the accordion, polyphony is a "pro", but weight is a "con". There is not one best instrument, we need them all. However, Julio Giulietti once told me the accordion was the "greatest instrument in the world." I suppose he was biased.
 
If a 48 bass accordion is too heavy, how about a harmonium or pedal organ...you don't have to tote them?🤔
Here's an example (of course, they're not limited to liturgical music!!🤔)

Another example:

Note:
There's a portable reed organ in this South African dance band

Another example (different band):
 
Last edited:
sebwin said:
Hello,

I play the diatonic Accordian/melodeon, but my partner (previously played piano) wants to start learning the piano Accordian (which I know nothing about!)

They’re playing a (what looks to me) large Dino baffeti piano Accordian with 26 piano keys (white and black) and 48 bass buttons.

It looks a bit like this except there are obviously fewer basses and only 2 “voice” switches


An issue with practicing is, unlike my melodeons, it’s very heavy, which is acting as a barrier to just “picking it up” and doing little bits of practice.

I realise in the world of accordians it probably isn’t that heavy, but I’m trying to find a much smaller/lighter one and wondering if anyone could give me any ideas (we’re in the Uk)

The music will primarily be English/Irish trad (so 2 octaves and few basses (won’t need augmented ones etc etc)) and Christmas carols.

Does anyone kindly have any ideas?

Thanks for your time
Click to expand...
You can avoid “picking it up”by storing the accordion on a suitable height padded shelf or table so that you just swing round on your chair and leave it in the playing position
 
colinm said:
You can avoid “picking it up”by storing the accordion on a suitable height padded shelf or table so that you just swing round on your chair and leave it in the playing position
Click to expand...
Indeed. And sooner of later the accordion will tumble down... I already had to repair a few accordions (from friends) that fell down from a table or chair. Definitely not my favorite repair job! Luckily they were all accordions with black celluloid. I can only do a good job on the cosmetic finish if the accordion is covered with black celluloid.
 
The OP said the focus will be Irish/English trad and carols. There is simply no need to have a big accordion for those uses unless one is absolutely yearning for that. It is sad how overlooked small chromatic accordions often are for folk/trad music. They are blocked on one side by the blinkered rigidity in the folk crowd of prejudice in favor of bisonoric button instruments, and blocked on the other side by the blinkered rigidity of big-instrument snobbery and disdain for smaller-sizes on the part of the PA and CBA crowd. I do prefer a 26/60 to a 26/48, because then you have basses and chords for each chromatic note, without adding noticeable weight. For some folk music it's great to have 30 treble notes, and CBAs are grand here, because a CBA gives you 30 treble notes in a chassis the size of a 26-key PA. But for Irish trad and many other folk genres you absolutely can do it on a 26/48.

Having gotten that off my chest, the poster above is correct that a 26/48 2-voice is about as small as you will get in a PA. However, one suggestion might be to weigh the Dino Baffetti. Not all small PAs weigh the same. I bought one of these about a year and a half ago for folk/trad and liked it very much. But I did notice that the build felt heavy and bulky compared to a Weltmeister Perle 26/48 I purchased used on the auction site about 6 years ago. (Both of these instruments and others were stolen in a ransacking of my home by burglars this last February, but that's another story, a sad and traumatic story.)

I didn't weigh the Baffetti but I remember thinking, whoa, this guy feels like 14 pounds here. The Baffetti might prove to weigh a good couple pounds more than something like a 26/48 Weltmeister Perle, in a way that might make a difference when it comes to that desire to pick it up and practice or play. I didn't mind, but I did notice the difference, and noticed this as well in a Bugari 26/48 I've played. That too felt like a 14-pound instrument. New contemporary small Weltmeisters are very playable and responsive for folk music while having a lighter, quote-unquote "flimsier" build that can actually be easier to handle for some trad players.

Responsiveness comes not only from your reeds. It comes from a number of components, and one is the chassis or cabinet itself. Ironically, provided the accordion is playable in other respects, a "flimsier" build can sometimes be more pleasurable to tote around and play in folk/trad settings, where there is a high premium on ease and lightness. Whereas the "better-built" Baffetti and Bugari with classic quality Italian construction were bigger and heavier 26/48s that for some folks might be less easy to play and move around with. A gigging Tex-Mex/Norteno/Cajun player I know likes contemporary Weltmeister 26/48s specifically for how light and responsive the chassis are. Some folk/trad players seek out the vintage Hohner Starlet and Hohner "Junior 48" models for this quality--but there, the rub is getting one in good nick due to their age and often their heavy past use.

You might put that Baffetti on a scale and do some comps with other 26/48s such as a contemporary Welt. I'm not knocking the Baffetti, I loved mine--but the idea is to maximize playing time and playing joy by getting the right thing for the individual player.
 
Last edited:
OuijaBoard said:
The OP said the focus will be Irish/English trad and carols. There is simply no need to have a big accordion for those uses unless one is absolutely yearning for that. It is sad how overlooked small chromatic accordions often are for folk/trad music.
Click to expand...

I started with a 12-bass, then a 72 bass, playing Morris dances. Then a Perle 48 bass. As I moved to the 48 bass the Morris side commented how much better the accordion sounded, and I think the size of the 72, especially the larger bellows couldn't provide the right energy for dancing. In that regard I kind of regret selling my cheap Scarlatti 12-bass as it was lightweight and could play nearly all the tunes - just lacking an Em button, though a G fundamental could cover. In that regard a good quality 12 or 24 bass would have really suited me. I'm in a new Morris side now and they're following a different musical direction, so I play mandolin. Which is cool, but I do miss playing accordion as much :cry:
 
Last edited:
Rosie C said:
I started with a 12-bass, then a 72 bass, playing Morris dances. Then a Perle 48 bass. As I moved to the 48 bass the Morris side commented how much better the accordion sounded, and I think the size of the 72, especially the larger bellows couldn't provide the right energy for dancing. In that regard I kind of regret selling my cheap Scarlatti 12-bass as it was lightweight and could play nearly all the tunes - just lacking an Em button, though a G fundamental could cover. In that regard a good quality 12 or 24 bass would have really suited me. I'm in a new Morris side now and they're following a different musical direction, so I play mandolin. Which is cool, but I do miss playing accordion as much :cry:
Click to expand...

Don't stop learning and practicing tchoooonz on your Perle! These trad situations are an ever-shifting scenario, and they do have a way of cycling around!

I know just what you mean about the bellows energy. It's not that one would be playing a small PA literally like a one-row melodeon, but you do get more bellows movement, and more air movement with the "feel" that goes with that for dance-based trad music, when playing small ones.

Charming set of sound samples here:

 
Last edited:
OuijaBoard said:
Don't stop learning and practicing tchoooonz on your Perle! These trad situations are an ever-shifting scenario, and they do have a way of cycling around!
Click to expand...

Promise! I'm actively looking for a new outlet.

OuijaBoard said:
I know just what you mean about the bellows energy. It's not that one would be playing a small PA literally like a one-row melodeon, but you do get more bellows movement, and more air movement with the "feel" that goes with that for dance-based trad music, when playing small ones.

Charming set of sound samples here:

Click to expand...

Oh, I like the look of that. Not one tune I've heard before!
 
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