Problem with Roland FR-3s

[Big Squeezy Accordions]

I was recently given an old FR-3s. I'm an acoustic accordion technician and frankly never had a lot of interest in these, but I figure it'll come in handy for practicing late at night with headphones, and as a reference for various musette tunings. It seems to work pretty well, except that some of the lowest notes on the keyboard only begin sounding at very high bellows pressure. Does anyone know what could cause this, and if it is fixable?

 

[dak]

Uh, wow? The keyboard has no mechanical connection/relation with the bellows. So it has to be either a human connection (you press the keys harder when pressing the bellows harder?) or an electronic connection (lower notes need slightly higher pressure but the pressure sensor is maladjusted and almost tops out before?).

Do you experience this both on push and pull? Have you done a factory reset yet?

 

[Big Squeezy Accordions]

Uh, wow? The keyboard has no mechanical connection/relation with the bellows. So it has to be either a human connection (you press the keys harder when pressing the bellows harder?) or an electronic connection (lower notes need slightly higher pressure but the pressure sensor is maladjusted and almost tops out before?).

Do you experience this both on push and pull? Have you done a factory reset yet?

Yes, on push and pull. Oddly, it's not uniform among the lower keys. So, for example, the lowest A will only sound at maximum bellows pressure, whereas the G below that sounds normally. I have not tried a factory reset. I will look up how to do that.

 

[dunlustin]

The pressure reset is under Troubleshooting for the X versions' manual - something like 'erratic belllows behaviour'

 

[Big Squeezy Accordions]

Uh, wow? The keyboard has no mechanical connection/relation with the bellows. So it has to be either a human connection (you press the keys harder when pressing the bellows harder?) or an electronic connection (lower notes need slightly higher pressure but the pressure sensor is maladjusted and almost tops out before?).

Do you experience this both on push and pull? Have you done a factory reset yet?

So, I did a factory reset and there is no change. Actually, on further investigation it seems to be less about bellows pressure and more a matter of certain notes sounding late or sometimes not at all. It's also a problem with a couple of the C bass buttons, though not the main one in the middle. There is a couple of seconds delay when playing certain keys or buttons, though sometimes they sound right away and sometimes not at all. Maybe some connection needs cleaning?

 

[Jibberin]

I had a similar on my Fr8x with a bass note not sound or late sounding or occasionally working correctly. Took it to a Roland Technician who inspected it and said most of the little connectors were worn and replaced all 120. The parts Amounted to £60. Sounds kinda similar to your problem.

 

[John M]

I had a similar on my Fr8x with a bass note not sound or late sounding or occasionally working correctly. Took it to a Roland Technician who inspected it and said most of the little connectors were worn and replaced all 120. The parts Amounted to £60. Sounds kinda similar to your problem.

Since I have an 8X, I am interested in what these 120 little connectors were. Does anyone on the forum know?
Thanks - John

 

[Jibberin]

They were flexible caps with two carbon pins in them.

 

[John M]

They were flexible caps with two carbon pins in them.

Thanks for your reply. 120 connectors is a lot. I just had my 8X loose upper strap bracket repaired by Tim Swanson of Capital Accordion. It is now very securely fastened once he got down to the nuts holding down the bracket.

In the process, Tim had to remove many flat ribbon & wire cables that had high density connectors with many pins. Is it possible that you are referring to one of these multi-pin connectors?

 

[Jibberin]

The Tecky showed me one. I assume they’re fitted individually and when the bass button is pushed the carbon rods complete a circuit to produce a sound.

 

[John M]

Thanks -- I think I understand now. It was all on the Bass side. I should have read your post more closely. S-o-o, he replaced the contact pin on every bass button --120 of them. Wow!

 

[tcabot]

Sounds like worn keyboard contacts/silicone but I'd expect the most used range to suffer first. It is very odd that you are getting these issues on lesser-used notes. Given that the first gen boxes are about 20 years old (?), this might just be age-related deterioration.

Very odd.

 

[Pipemajor]

I had a very similar problem with my fr3xb.
The G above middle C worked fine at slow speeds but when playing fast, would either not sound or be intermittent.
I took it to a Roland service agent who changed 3 or 4 of these contacts.
Not particularly expensive, but took about 4 months due to being so busy.
He did say that these contacts were not being made anymore but he had some in stock.

 

[John M]

Are the contacts in the 8X and 4X the same as in the 3 series?

 

[Keymn]

Look in the troubleshooting section of the manual. There is a part that explains how to fix erratic bellow behavior.
The key switches are rubber contacts and the same in all synth keyboards. I recently replaced all the rubber contacts on my Korg keyboard. They looked like this from wear and tear…see the indentations of the old ones, middle pic is the old set…the last picture is an assembly drawing of I think the FR8x keybed? Sometimes removing the rubber contacts and cleaning the contact circuit board with a light cleaner. One little dirt particle could mess up a note. I found a pencil eraser is best as I am not a fan of any solvents. Then put your hair dryer on cool and blow away any debris.

 

[Keymn]

Are the contacts in the 8X and 4X the same as in the 3 series?

Contacts like other Roland parts are usually not available for consumers. These rubber contacts may be different part numbers? I do not have a service manual for FR4x or fr3. Companies like Syntaur

Roland Synthesizer Models Repair Parts and Accessories

Parts, specs, and pictures for Roland Synthesizers.

syntaur.com

Or Full Compass

Roland Parts, Replacement & Service

Browse our huge selection of Roland Parts, Replacement & Service products and more at FullCompass.com. Free Shipping on thousands of items!

www.fullcompass.com

may be able to get the parts or have some in stock.

But I think you are dealing with dirty contacts or erratic bellows as found in the troubleshooting section of the manual.

 

[dak]

Look in the troubleshooting section of the manual. There is a part that explains how to fix erratic bellow behavior.
The key switches are rubber contacts and the same in all synth keyboards. I recently replaced all the rubber contacts on my Korg keyboard. They looked like this from wear and tear…see the indentations of the old ones, middle pic is the old set…the last picture is an assembly drawing of I think the FR8x keybed? Sometimes removing the rubber contacts and cleaning the contact circuit board with a light cleaner. One little dirt particle could mess up a note. I found a pencil eraser is best as I am not a fan of any solvents. Then put your hair dryer on cool and blow away any debris.

With those contacts, a CBA gives you less leverage for mushing the rubber into a paste.

On a different note, when I received my preowned FR-1b, there were some buttons in the treble that always put out full velocity when button noise was enabled. I diassembled the keyboard, and turning the respective rubber strip 180° (it looked pretty much the same, but I think some tiny air holes then ended up in the same orientation as with the other strips) fixrd the problem. Was it factory or a previous owner? No idea. But when taking the treble apart, you easily get into the situation where those strips may fall out. Each strip just serves about 3 or 4 buttons.

 

[Keymn]

With those contacts, a CBA gives you less leverage for mushing the rubber into a paste.

On a different note, when I received my preowned FR-1b, there were some buttons in the treble that always put out full velocity when button noise was enabled. I diassembled the keyboard, and turning the respective rubber strip 180° (it looked pretty much the same, but I think some tiny air holes then ended up in the same orientation as with the other strips) fixrd the problem. Was it factory or a previous owner? No idea. But when taking the treble apart, you easily get into the situation where those strips may fall out. Each strip just serves about 3 or 4 buttons.

They install only one way. As the two contact bubbles for each note is slightly different heights. The harder you press, the second bubble makes contact. This is how velocity is created. But not familiar with CBA contact layout. I would like to see a layout…

 

[Keymn]

Hope this helps. Not especially about accordion, but all keyboards/synths have same rules.

contact strip – Synth Wizards

 

[dak]

They install only one way. As the two contact bubbles for each note is slightly different heights. The harder you press, the second bubble makes contact. This is how velocity is created. But not familiar with CBA contact layout. I would like to see a layout…

Like this?

This is a separate PCB for the lowest two button rows removed. I think the strip still behind the buttons may be shown to be the wrong way round.