Gonk
http://mudlark-music.com
Just had to share. Some folks just brought over a beautiful LMMM Galanti for some repairs...and the reedplates are RED.
That is all.
That is all.
Red reedplates!
- Thread starter Gonk
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Dingo40
Been here for ages!
Colourful!
Are they anodised?
Are they anodised?
Gonk
http://mudlark-music.com
I think so, and my best guess is that they were threaded onto something using the reed slots, and hung in the dye/acid bath in rows. (The insides of the slots are red as well.)
I was wondering how it could have been done. It's not a very even color. It first sight it looked painted, but anodised is much more likely as the reeds themselves are unaffected so it must be a process that only colors the aluminium and not steel. I doubt that apart from looking unique and pretty it has any effect on the sound.
Dingo40
Been here for ages!
My guess is that the reed plates were anodised before the reeds were affixed to them as the reeds would likely be damaged by the acid bath.
See here:
See here:
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Ventura
Been here for ages!
Galanti was a Family that was outside the Castlefidardo influence
AND
they were one of the few companies who set up a true American branch
of their business (prior to WW2 during the heydey of New York's accordion superiority
as industry innovators)
their accordions often had small innovations and interesting differences,
like their dissapearing bellows closure strap,
and because of the back and forth exchange of trusted ideas and info
flowing between the American branch and Italian branch of the Galanti family,
they were nible in the marketplace
they had one of the first "modern" all Black professional style accordions
to compete with the new Excelsiors, which were blowing up the market with their
trajectory away from the "Art case" Vaudeville looking accordions typical of the time
who knows why they tried the anodized plates, but it fits their "style"
and is a great find in such contrast with the "Cookie cutter" boutique accordions of today
ciao
Ventura
AND
they were one of the few companies who set up a true American branch
of their business (prior to WW2 during the heydey of New York's accordion superiority
as industry innovators)
their accordions often had small innovations and interesting differences,
like their dissapearing bellows closure strap,
and because of the back and forth exchange of trusted ideas and info
flowing between the American branch and Italian branch of the Galanti family,
they were nible in the marketplace
they had one of the first "modern" all Black professional style accordions
to compete with the new Excelsiors, which were blowing up the market with their
trajectory away from the "Art case" Vaudeville looking accordions typical of the time
who knows why they tried the anodized plates, but it fits their "style"
and is a great find in such contrast with the "Cookie cutter" boutique accordions of today
ciao
Ventura
Yes. I once had a super dominator that had all sorts of little differences in styles. Like you mentioned the bellows clasps you would pull out. Also it was the first accordion that I saw that didnโt use wax to secure the reeds. It was leather and nails. Iโve seen others since then, but I remember being intrigued by the wax less. The leathers alerts brightly colored too. Iโve never seen red reed plates before.
Itโs cool to see what ideas โstuckโ and how accordion manufacturing evolved.
Itโs cool to see what ideas โstuckโ and how accordion manufacturing evolved.
Gonk
http://mudlark-music.com
Yes. I love the retracting clasps as well. These reeds are also riveted with washers between the tongue and rivet head. I'm guessing this was to intended to spread out the pressure and clamp the reed evenly...I imagine it would also allow a good deal of force to be applied to the rivet without any ill effect on the reed tongue.
And they tried some some ideas that didn't stick, and with good reason ... contropelli made from thin strips of celluloid must have seemed like a good idea at the time, but they haven't aged well! Look at the poor things...
And they tried some some ideas that didn't stick, and with good reason ... contropelli made from thin strips of celluloid must have seemed like a good idea at the time, but they haven't aged well! Look at the poor things...
boxplayer4000
Prolific poster
My guess is it wasn't done for appearance. How could it? It might only be seen by a repair man every 10 or 15 years, if lucky.
More information about the material used might help. Is the red coat a protective measure. Sadly with the passage of time
it will become more difficult to get information.
More information about the material used might help. Is the red coat a protective measure. Sadly with the passage of time
it will become more difficult to get information.
petch
Well-known member
I believe anodising (if that's how the colour was achieved) can prevent some corrosion - but I would expect the last thing to corrode in an accordion would be the aluminium parts!
Ventura
Been here for ages!
wait..how heavy are the reedplates ?
could they have tried anodizing the zinc on
those pre-aluminum reedplates ?
i found this:
Zinc is rarely anodized, but a process was developed by the International Lead Zinc Research Organization and covered by MIL-A-81801. A solution of ammonium phosphate, chromate and fluoride with voltages of up to 200 V can produce olive green coatings up to 80 ฮผm thick. The coatings are hard and corrosion resistant.
could they have tried anodizing the zinc on
those pre-aluminum reedplates ?
i found this:
Zinc is rarely anodized, but a process was developed by the International Lead Zinc Research Organization and covered by MIL-A-81801. A solution of ammonium phosphate, chromate and fluoride with voltages of up to 200 V can produce olive green coatings up to 80 ฮผm thick. The coatings are hard and corrosion resistant.
Dingo40
Been here for ages!
Neither zinc nor lead need any extra anti-corrosion coating. Both are protected by a thin layer of oxide which forms naturally and halts further oxidation of the metal.
Hot zinc dipped "galvanised " corrugated mild steel sheet (also nails, bolts etc) will last a hundred years plus. That's why they had to develop a new fangled zinc-alume coating (lasts 40 years, if you're lucky) to
shorten the potential service life of metal roofing and fencing and increase the turnover rate!
Plain lead sheet has been used to roof churches, cathedrals and palaces for hundreds of years (and for plumbing by the Romans and Greeks before that! It's so corrosion resistant that hundreds of meters of lead piping have been excavated on Roman sites ( still good to go).
Aluminium has been around a surprisingly long time, possibly predadating all but the diatonic accordions ( mid 1800s). In any case, pre- aluminium reed plates were most likely to be of brass rather than lead, as lead is very soft and wouldn't respond well to riveting in the reeds.
Hot zinc dipped "galvanised " corrugated mild steel sheet (also nails, bolts etc) will last a hundred years plus. That's why they had to develop a new fangled zinc-alume coating (lasts 40 years, if you're lucky) to
shorten the potential service life of metal roofing and fencing and increase the turnover rate!
Plain lead sheet has been used to roof churches, cathedrals and palaces for hundreds of years (and for plumbing by the Romans and Greeks before that! It's so corrosion resistant that hundreds of meters of lead piping have been excavated on Roman sites ( still good to go
).Aluminium has been around a surprisingly long time, possibly predadating all but the diatonic accordions ( mid 1800s). In any case, pre- aluminium reed plates were most likely to be of brass rather than lead, as lead is very soft and wouldn't respond well to riveting in the reeds.
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boxplayer4000
Prolific poster
Dingo40
Very interesting.
I'm pretty certain I've seen instances of aluminium deterioration/corrosion. It breaks down into a dusty deposit. However it's quite rare in my experience and don't know if it's more prevalent in different kinds of climate.
Very interesting.
I'm pretty certain I've seen instances of aluminium deterioration/corrosion. It breaks down into a dusty deposit. However it's quite rare in my experience and don't know if it's more prevalent in different kinds of climate.
Dingo40
Been here for ages!
Yes, seaside aluminium window frames seem to break down to dust: sea salt is bad for aluminium!
Actually, I'm much impressed by adequately maintained ( eg, painted ) wooden ( timber) windows, doors and flyscreen frames.
Mine are well over 100 years old and still going strong! Beat that with aluminium!
Actually, I'm much impressed by adequately maintained ( eg, painted ) wooden ( timber) windows, doors and flyscreen frames.
Mine are well over 100 years old and still going strong! Beat that with aluminium!
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Gonk
http://mudlark-music.com
Ventura, they're definitely aluminum -- there was a spot where a tiny scratch showed the bright metal underneath.
Quick research suggests that while aluminum oxide forms on all aluminum, anodizing thickens that layer and provides extra corrosion protection . https://www.3erp.com/blog/everything-about-anodizing-aluminum/
Some speculation: I wonder if there was some show room appeal to this treatment. There were accordion conventions and product display stalls in the '50s and '60s, and it would have stood out. Also: while these weren't hand riveted, the tolerances are very close and the tone is excellent. I'm familiar with Galanti reeds from that period and these are the nicest I've heard. Could this have been a way of denoting a higher grade of reed? Perhaps as a kind of stamp of authenticity, or a form of insurance against reed theft or swapping?
Quick research suggests that while aluminum oxide forms on all aluminum, anodizing thickens that layer and provides extra corrosion protection . https://www.3erp.com/blog/everything-about-anodizing-aluminum/
Some speculation: I wonder if there was some show room appeal to this treatment. There were accordion conventions and product display stalls in the '50s and '60s, and it would have stood out. Also: while these weren't hand riveted, the tolerances are very close and the tone is excellent. I'm familiar with Galanti reeds from that period and these are the nicest I've heard. Could this have been a way of denoting a higher grade of reed? Perhaps as a kind of stamp of authenticity, or a form of insurance against reed theft or swapping?
Ventura
Been here for ages!
i also am inclined to believe back then they sold the "meat"
to the market because they believed a better educated customer
will make the better choice. Having unique and thougtful improvements,
no matter how small, showed they cared about the customer as well as
made them more memorable for future consideration.
as thing transitioned in the 50's to selling mostly "sizzle" the incentive
to manufacturers changed, of course, until virtually everyone
(except Exceclsior) put 5 shifts on 2 reed student accordions
(and other such genteel deceptions)
if only the sound and playability of accordions improved in proportion to the amount
of chrome !
to the market because they believed a better educated customer
will make the better choice. Having unique and thougtful improvements,
no matter how small, showed they cared about the customer as well as
made them more memorable for future consideration.
as thing transitioned in the 50's to selling mostly "sizzle" the incentive
to manufacturers changed, of course, until virtually everyone
(except Exceclsior) put 5 shifts on 2 reed student accordions
(and other such genteel deceptions)
if only the sound and playability of accordions improved in proportion to the amount
of chrome !
boxplayer4000
Prolific poster
Gonk:-
Daft question but can you see if the underside of the reeds are also red?
Daft question but can you see if the underside of the reeds are also red?
Gonk
http://mudlark-music.com
Yes indeed
Just a thought, could this have been a special order by someone who wanted to use the box aboard a ship or boat where, in the early days, "Marine Aluminium" was not existant.
The tradition of squeezebox entertainment by and for sailors is well established.
The tradition of squeezebox entertainment by and for sailors is well established.
But the reeds themselves are still exposed steel, arenโt they?
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