• If you haven't done so already, please add a location to your profile. This helps when people are trying to assist you, suggest resources, etc. Thanks (Click the "X" to the top right of this message to disable it)

Advice on Upgrading

  • Thread starter Thread starter Pianoman1
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
P

Pianoman1

Guest
I have a (to me) Hohner 72 bass which as a newbie serves my needs - Arietta 11m I think It is light for me and
I play folk and popular stuff on it (within my limits)

I would be grateful for insight into why people play 120 bass PAs - what type of music it is useful for If I am thinking of upgrading should I go for a better 72 bass or 90 bass or the full 120

I want to play dixieland jazz - light classical - tuneful jazz - and standards as I progress
I am told 120 bass are heavy and cumbersome - obviously I can go a store and try one but I think tapping into the collective wisdom of the forum here would help in any decision Thank you
 
How old are you and in what physical shape are you? This more than anything else will define your capacity to handle the bigger boxes. For me, when I play the near 30lbs 185 bass Hohner Morino an hour and then switch to the 22lbs 120 bass Elka, I feel as if I could rip it apart if I am not careful... lol

Neither is too heavy for me, though I won't be running any marathons with the Hohner. I am close to 56 years old but in good physical health and am fairly strong and quite active. I could never see myself playing anything smaller than a 120 bass. My styles vary from "hard core" classical to german/Czech folk music so I do use the bass range, but that said, when playing the more traditional music, it's pretty rare that one needs 120 bass systems in my experience, but there is a lot more to those larger 120 bass accordions than just the extra bass buttons, and those reasons are why I enjoy the larger sizes.
 
(I've told this a couple of times before on this forum,) I'd heard that 120s are "too big" like you say, but having tried, then bought, a Hohner Atlantic that came up locally on Ebay nearly a year ago, I've been very happy with it. It didn't take long to get used to the size and weight of it. I wouldn't want to play standing up for too long, or carry it on a bike, but it's quite manageable and has capabilities far in excess of my playing.

I don't have proof, but I think even within a given level of playing, you can get more for your money with a 120 because there are lots about and some people are afraid of them.


What am I saying! No you don't want a 120! They are far too big and heavy! Leave them for other people to buy!!! :twisted:
Tom
(Adding info in the light of Jerry's post, I'm similar age, quite light build, 5'8" and quite comfortable with my 120, within limits.)

[Adding a bit more, I guess the distance from your lap to chin may be relevant! You want to be able to see over it without having to always play half standing.]
 
You need to consider the treble keyboard do I need 41 keys,if the answer is yes then 120 it will have to be.Next are you able handle a full size,they are heavy but with backstrap on I and others at age 80 are managing to knock out some tunes.I have a. lighter Elka but prefer the Guerrini s sound so its the one that gets played more.I dont know of 96 bass s that have the 41 keys.
Usually they have 37.For me I would want cassotto sound ,thats just a personal thing,hope this helps in search.
 
Thanks for the prompt response I am 6 feet 220 pounds plus I can lift 50 pounds plus with one hand 10 - 12 times as I weight train

I want the longer keyboard so 120 bass it is thanks you have made up my mind !
 
Pianoman,

It appears that you have already made up your mind, and that my input may be irrelevant at this stage. Be this as it may, it will not hurt to look again at your options.

As you may recall, Brenda & I are members of a Folk Club. Though it is a rare event, we do occasionally visit other Folk Clubs. At one of these Folk Clubs, there is a middle-aged chap who plays a little 8 Bass accordion. It is very obviously an old instrument and, despite its diminutive size, this chap plays a wide range of tunes on it.

For what it is worth, I would only buy a bigger instrument if it was absolutely necessary for the range of music I intend to play. It may be different for you, but I cannot see myself ever needing an instrument above 72 Bass.

Whatever instrument you choose to buy, I hope you enjoy playing it.

Good Luck,

Stephen Hawkins.
 
Oh yes, this has to be repeated... the music that comes out of an accordion is ultimately not the result of the accordion itself, but of the person holding it. I also hear a very similar question in the photography forums phrased as "should I upgrade my camera?" and my answer is don't ever upgrade unless you are sure that you feel constrained, restricted or that it is in some way holding you back. If, for example, one's goal is to become a professional and one feels frustration when playing thanks to technical limitations of the instrument... then yes, it is time to upgrade, but really... not before, at least not without a lot of thinking things over.

I have a few expensive hobbies, photography being one of them, and for the amount of money that I spent in hardware, I could have easily bought myself a Hohner Gola and have money to spare. The one thing that I am very proud to say, is that I regret NOT ONE item. I will never experience buyer's remorse because I research the heck out of everything before laying out my hard earned money.

One must remember, forums are not for asking to make final decisions, they are about asking for opinions, and should be valued as such. One must always make their own decisions and research. You may indeed make the same decision as the opinions offered here, or you may not... but in the end, it needs to be YOUR decision... never ask someone to spend your money for you, that's the fast path to unhappiness and a WRONG decision. How can anyone else other than you yourself better know what your needs are? :)
 
Pianoman,

Jerry has hit the nail on the head ----- it is all about what you want and need. If the music you intend to play requires 120 Bass & 41 Trebles, that is what you should buy. If not, stick with the smaller instrument.

It really is just a question of identifying and differentiating between "needs" and "wants", and arriving at a conclusion which best suits you.

I have recently been offered an "as new" 72 Bass, which is currently under serious consideration. My dilemma is the same one that you face, as I am not quite sure that the music I play would actually warrant the purchase of this instrument.

Again, good luck with whatever you eventually decide to do.

Stephen Hawkins.
 
Stephen Hawkins said:
Pianoman,

It appears that you have already made up your mind, and that my input may be irrelevant at this stage. Be this as it may, it will not hurt to look again at your options.

As you may recall, Brenda & I are members of a Folk Club. Though it is a rare event, we do occasionally visit other Folk Clubs. At one of these Folk Clubs, there is a middle-aged chap who plays a little 8 Bass accordion. It is very obviously an old instrument and, despite its diminutive size, this chap plays a wide range of

Stephen Hawkins.
Click to expand...

Shows its not the box but the player. Ive seen a few who play diminutive accordions well over the years. They really come into their own at festivals etc., where they have to be lugged around all day (and night) long.
You cant make sweet music if its locked up in the car.
 
Indeed it's not the box but it's the combination of the player, the box, the venues you play at and the music you play. Which is why many players have more than one instrument as no single box is suitable for everything.
And another mistake people make is to think of "size" as being "number of basses". With modern technologies making things more and more compact this is no longer valid. There are 120 bass accordions that are smaller (and maybe even lighter) than some 80 or 96 bass accordions. Therefore you need to always see, feel, play an instrument before deciding it is for you or not.
There is an important difference between PA and CBA in that with a PA the keyboard size is really the limiting factor. A 41 key keyboard is large, 45 is very large, much larger does not exist (max is 49 I believe). The keyboard size (range) on smaller PA becomes the limiting factor as to what you can play. With a CBA it's a whole different ball game. I have a Bugari 540/ARS/C which is 41x22.3x43.5cm, smaller than many 96 bass PA's. It is *really small*, yet it has 52 notes on the right hand side, 120 bass and convertor with 49 notes on the left hand side, L+M in cassotto... a marvel of engineering that would be impossible in a PA because of the keyboard size.
 
Heres a great example of a nice sounding, very nicely played, smaller accordion. I always play a full size 120 bass accordion, but when I saw this I was impressed with the quality of sound. If I ever need to go to something smaller, this would do I think. ALso I would definitely try a few full size accordions, sometimes they just feel right.

 
Thanks again for the really useful insights This forum is far more helpful than some guitar forums I have been on !

1 Upgrading - I am keeping the 72 bass - I love it so 120 bass would be an addition
2 Age and weight - I am 71 this year - I take the view if I want something musical and I can afford it - I buy it as now is the time

3 Size - I am a beginner of course on the PA so input from experienced players is invaluable - I am finding the smaller keyboard limiting in scope

4 In the UK the Hobgoblin chain has a selection of PAs in stock and does Youtube guides to models - as they are folk orientated they are pretty down on the 120 bass system because of the weight and size BUT I want to play jazz and standards in different keys so the extra facilities would be useful Once again thanks for the advice and help
 
Honestly, for me with 3 key comments, you have justified why a 120 bass system is in your future.

Now comes the fun part, finding that one special one that fits you like a glove and makes you smile with every note. :)
 
If jazz is your thing you might want to look for a cassotto instrument. They tend to cost more but the tone for jazz makes all the difference. Some hand made reeds are good enough without cassotto but still tend to sound bright in comparison. Good for early jazz but after the 40s/50s most used cassotto. What is your favourite jazz accordion album or video? It might help you in narrowing down the choices.
 
The little that I do know is that the Excelsior 940 is considered one of the top jazz accordions around anywhere. What one may want to do is listen to that sound see if it suits the tastes and if it is a case of "close but not quite", then look around at other similar styles of accordions. Visually, I always really liked the look of these models... very pretty!
 
I would just like to commend all the contributors to this thread for their very useful and non-partisan advice. It is refreshing in this day and age to see such truly helpful and interesting advice being given so freely. Keep it up.

Stephen Hawkins.
 
I endorse Steven Hawkins comments - thanks again for the input
 
Size: I'm a 58 yrs old, 5'2, 130 lb little old woman. I play the 120 PA. I've been playing the 120 since I was a very small little petite girl at age 10. The full size accordion has never been an issue for me. I love it and would not want to lose any of my bass or treble capacities.

Try one on for size and comfort before buying. I would not trade a full size accordion for a smaller one.

BrandyD
 
Brandy,

Please don't say that you are old at 58, as that makes me feel ancient. In future you should consider the terms "experienced" or "mature."

Kind Regards,

Stephen Hawkins. (experienced & mature)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

M
Advice for a portable speaker for FR1XB Roland
Replies
5
Views
139
Tafaner
T
C
ISO advice on buying reed valves
Replies
1
Views
93
debra
debra
losthobos
    • Like
Advice .....
Replies
4
Views
198
dak
dak
frankpmcenroe
Accordion tuner online. need advice.
Replies
17
Views
354
Siegmund
S
H
    • Very Funny
    • Wow
    • Like
Advice from an old method book.
Replies
11
Views
336
dak
dak
Back
Top