Amplification

[TW]

I use an FR1XB to drive a V3 desktop.

You will probably already know that the Scottish sounds available from this system are first class.
For example, this barn dance:-



I do not achieve this sound quality.

Given that my V3 is working properly and that the MIDI driver is irrelevant to sound quality then does the problem lie in the amplification?

The amplification I have available is a Sony stereo amp (with 5 speakers, used in a home cinema system) and a Peavey 25w (guitar?) practice amp with a mono input.

Could members give an opinion about whether the amplification system is the likely culprit here or should I be looking elsewhere in the system?
If the amp is likely, are there any recommendations members could make for an amp with inputs from R&L channels, for use in the home?

 

[JerryPH]

I have a thought or two. I don't think it would be a bad idea if you emailed him and asked how he does things, but I suspect he is recording either straight in to his camera's stereo inputs or he is doing what I would do, and that is to capture to video me playing, output the music simultaneously to my computer (DAW or Digital Audio Workstation) and out the speakers.

Then touch up the digital recording a bit and overlay the cleaned up audio over the audio of the video, export a video file and upload it to YouTube. At that point the results should sound stunning, just like in his video.

To get quality sound in real life, one needs quality amplifiers and speakers designed for live performances, but watching those videos on youtube would still not capture the results as nicely, you need to get the clean digital sounds captured before it exits the speakers, not the output of your speakers on your video.

Make sense?

I maybe could make a short video showing the entire process, just to show the results, if things are not quite clear enough for you.

 

[Glenn]

I agree with Jerry. Direct input of the V3 into a digital recorder is the obvious way to go. Why would you record a digital sound via an amplifier unless you particularly wanted the effect the amplifier has on the sound to be recorded. Not only the amplifier has an influence but the microphone as well . In addition, the positioning of the microphone is even more important. Direct recording is thus the easiest as well.

 

[TW]

Excellent replies for which I am grateful Gentlemen but I perhaps havent worded my query well.

Im not concerned with making recordings, what I would like is for the sound I hear in my room to be the sound I hear on the You-tube clips.
i.e. sounds produced by the Rolands on board amp in my room are just as I hear in clips and I would like to achieve the same from the amplified output of the V3?

Question perhaps is finding a suitable amp .....?

(edited) Could members give an opinion about whether the amplification system is the likely culprit here or should I be looking elsewhere in the system?
If the amp is likely, are there any recommendations members could make for equipment, accepting inputs from R&L channels of the expander, for use in the home?

 

[debra]

As others have said the example recording is probably made without any amplifier / sound system in the loop.
So since you are looking for a sound system that doesn't help and it may be hard to replicate to your ears what you hear in the video.
I have been playing the accordion for almost 50 years and for many many years I was involved in trying to amplify the sound of our band(s) so that it would sound natural. We went through many types of speakers and amplifiers (tube, mosfet, you name it). In the end we settled on the Bose L1 model 2 with tonematch engine, and since using that the audience has been wondering how come we produce so much volume without it sounding like it was "electronically amplified".
It's expensive, I know, but really it has been the only thing I found that really works.

 

[JerryPH]

For live sound, for an amateur who plays mostly at home for personal pleasure a $5000 single Bose speaker may be over budget, but I think that if he wanted something that was a mono (not stereo) solution that sounded reasonable, he needs to use a basic component setup.

Perhaps start with a Behringer Eurolive B110D powered speaker (10" woofer, 300 watt output), route that through a small mixer (MACKIE MIX12FX compact 12 channel mixer with effects) and I think he would be much happier. The speaker is about $200 and the mixer is about $150. For home use, busking or even light professional use this is all that would be needed (give or take $50 for a stand and some cables) and you have a well under $500 solution with good clean sound.

If he wanted to go stereo, all that is needed is a 2nd identical speaker and 15 minutes of tweaking the sound image and voila! I think that would do all the he desires, and then some and still not too far over $500.

That said, I would like to add the warning that listening to an edited digital YouTube recording and listening to a live performance through speakers in an ambient environment is never going to be a fair comparison. In the YouTube clips, you don't hear the room echo, the characteristics of the speaker, the quality of the microphones used to capture the sound or the neighbors dog. It is also likely equalized and processed to best effect. Basically it is an apples and oranges situation.

 

[debra]

For live sound, for an amateur who plays mostly at home for personal pleasure a $5000 single Bose speaker may be over budget, but I think that if he wanted something that was a mono (not stereo) solution that sounded reasonable, he needs to use a basic component setup.

For personal pleasure there is the Bose L1 Compact that sells for 999 euro here. Still a lot of money but it includes everything you need (including 2 tonematch channels). I have absolutely no commercial connection to Bose and in fact was not happy when my tonematch engine crapped out (long after warranty expired) and was expensive to get fixed. But in terms of sound quality it is simply the best.

 

[Glenn]

I've read a number of Roland V accordion users being happy with the Roland KC series of amplifiers.
For example the KC-60 (about 300€) is more than adequate for home use.
It has been mentioned on this forum before as well.

 

[TW]

Thank you all for your reviews of areas of kit that might be suitable for me..some items lie outside practicality of course.

Glenn's comment about the system used for the example recording is interesting but one might consider that the video clip's output, however recorded, is just one stage digital to audio transformation so does it not follow that a signal, generated from the same expander used for the music clip, should sound the same when heard directly through local amplification?
The pathway to audio is the same single transformation from a digital signal in either case.

Paul De Bra's remarks about the benefit of the Bose system have been echoed by many but, as he notes, the system is impracticable for personal use.

I think the pragmatic approach of JerryPH to my query has hit the spot and while 300w might be too much, maybe a Roland CM-30 30W Personal Monitor which has plenty of I/P's might do to try.
JerryPH's last paragraph about the difference in listening YouTube/vs live speaker says it all clearly and succinctly.

I think the answer to my initial post has been directed by the forum to poor amplification and that is the option I'll explore.

Thank you.

 

[TW]

My recent problem with my V3 expander proved to have a simple fix in the end; the solution was suggested by Roy Hendrie.

The V3 had been checked; the amp was known to work with inputs from the cinema system.

The fault proved to be damage to the feeder signal cable from the mixer; renewing the leads has completely solved the problem.

In retrospect it should have been one of the first things I checked....

 

[JerryPH]

"Renewing the leads"... you mean you just changed a cable or had work done on the mixer internals?

Either way... cheap fix!