Problematic Condition of New Accordion

[OuijaBoard]

A CBA may well have an access hatch on the back side of the treble keyboard... but that certainly doesn't seem to be the explanation for your cut away celluloid.

I confess it's not a place I would have thought to look, inspecting a newly arrived instrument, until this thread happened. I will start looking in the future. (And also make a mental note that if I can't find matching material for a celluloid repair, stealing some from here and adding a backpad is an option to propose to an owner.)

It wasn't a CBA. I did mention I have a small Asian-made Hohner Nova CBA that has a hatch on the back of the keyboard. But this was a PA. I've now posted numerous photos here of contemporary recent PAs: Italians, an East German Weltmeister PA, and an Asian-made Hohner Bravo PA. All of them small. All of them with completely intact celluloid on the entire rear of the accordion. No crooked gouged-out areas where someone hacked a chunk of celluloid away with a blade and the wood is stained from the color of the now-missing celluloid. No multi-thousand-dollar items with shoddy corner-cutting where chunks of bare wood were not covered with celluloid and a cheap panel has been nailed on to hide that. LOL.

Yes, one does check all around a multi-thousand-dollar instrument that has been shipped. Or a multi-hundred-dollar instrument that's been shipped. I've had very good luck with shipped items. But s*** happens. If you miss a crack or damage until it is too late to contest or do a return, you are out of luck. That, and, it was perfectly normal for me to do . . . given that every modern PA I've acquired has had the rear celluloid completely clear and visible, either with no backpad or under a pad with removable snaps. Naturally one has a look as due diligence after shipping. The fact that people have questioned that is mind-boggling to me.

 

[OuijaBoard]

Actually the dealer's gaslighting did include, I'm paraphrasing, "I suggest you get a backpad and play the instrument."

This would be different, of course, with a vintage item costing a couple hundred dollars. As folks have pointed out upthread, some of the mid-century/60s/70s vintage student-grade or German/Czech instruments do have a tacked-on panel of some kind that probably hides bare wood that wasn't covered with celluloid. But today even the Chinese Hohners are better produced than this multi-thousand-dollar brand-new Italian or supposedly Italian instrument delivered to me.

 

[tcabot]

"I suggest you get a backpad and play the instrument."

Send it back at their cost.

At this stage I'd personally go public with the name of the dealer who's treating their customers like that.
They are not your friends. They are a business. They usually operate very high mark-ups and in this case they are trying to screw you over. They sold you a faulty product (happens), but they have no right (moral, or legal, at least this side of the pond) not to refund or replace at the first request. If they are doing this to you, they will be doing this to others. I expect they'll be getting around $1k profit for this sale. Probably more, because I bet they spotted the issue and requested a discount from the manufacturer for faulty goods instead of sending it back. Why let them have it if they try to shit talk you into thinking your accordion is not faulty?

Frankly, the world will be a better place if a retailer like this goes out of business and the gap in the market gets filled by somebody who actually cares about the product and the customer.

 

[OuijaBoard]

Yes, thank you. They do have an automatic refund policy regardless, within a certain time, and it's being arranged. Arrangements are being made to ship it back. The shipping cost issue is still uncertain.

The dealer claimed in the back and forth that all the accordions in the batch were constructed the same way and said they'd send photos to prove it. It was part of the whole gaslighting thing about this being normal, and why was I questioning it, blah, blah. It's hard for me to believe given that as you can see in the photos, the naked area of wood is stained blue where there had been celluloid. But I wasn't going to accept the accordion in that state even if it was true all of them were like that.

But let's say it's true--IMHO that is just as bad as it would be if it was just damage to this one accordion and the dealer covered it up or was negligent about a look-over. If a name Castelfidardo house is doing shoddier work than the quality level of the cheap Weltmeister and Chinese Hohner shown in my photos upthread, and the instruments are being passed off as storied "Made in Castelfidardo" artisanship meriting multi-thousand-dollar price tags . . . I simply don't know what to say to that. And yes, the dealer knows better. They know that other Italian instruments of similar level, and even Weltmeisters and Chinese Hohners, are not constructed that way, because they carry them.

There has been input on other threads from experienced old hands with repair and with Italian product, that a very troubling and concerning reality today is that there is a lot of smoke and mirrors and substandard, shoddy work coming out of there and that an Italian label these days is no guarantee of quality. To that I would add, this is at the same time as prices are continuing ever-upward.

 

[Ric46]

Maybe I am a dreamer and I keep thinking that Ottavianelli did not send the dealer an accordion in that condition. Right to send it back and ask for a refund but I would write an email to Ottavianelli explaining what happened.

 

[OuijaBoard]

Maybe I am a dreamer and I keep thinking that Ottavianelli did not send the dealer an accordion in that condition. Right to send it back and ask for a refund but I would write an email to Ottavianelli explaining what happened.

I wrote to Ottavianelli first. Several hours later, I wrote the dealer, also forwarding what I wrote to Ottavianelli.

 

[craigd]

I had an Excelsior 940, 1960s vintage with a screwed down vinyl covered piece of cardboard underneath the back pad. When I was restoring it I removed that vinyl covered cardboard and found that most of the surface it covered was bare wood, the celluloid only extended to about an inch into the area covered. That didn't surprise me, it seemed fine, and I believe it allowed access to part of the palm switch mechanism, though I'm not sure about that anymore.

If yours had been fully screwed down, that lack of celluloid there wouldn't have surprised or bothered me at all, would probably not even have been noticed. The fact that it's loose is a bit odd, that flap doesn't extend over the bellows does it?

I would just screw it down and forget about it. Some of the wood accordions are made of doesn't look that great, probably looks cheaper than you expected, but I think that's common to a lot of accordions. The celluloid makes for a shiny colorful facade.

 

[John Doe]

Naturally one has a look as due diligence after shipping. The fact that people have questioned that is mind-boggling

I go through "a fair quantity" of accordions- pretty much all of them shipped in via FEDEX/UPS/USPS. (FEDEX has the best track record in handling based upon my sample and my local FEDEX delivery vans/drivers)

I never ever get a new to me accordion from any source- private individual or established dealer- without carefully inspecting it to include pulling the pins and poking about inside. Even with a knowledgeable and honest seller things happen and can be overlooked- wax cracking on reed plates, loose strap brackets, loosened block hold downs, cracked wax on pallets, lint in the bass machine, bits of crud shaken ree to get in the reeds or under the pallets, a hairline crack in a case corner... A few minutes of initial inspection can pay off big in avoiding issues that can go from quickly fixable to major pains.

I would surely do the same for a brand new instrument.

While a missing patch of celluloid under a back pad would almost surely have zero effect on the performance of an instrument it would not be OK if there was an attempt at concealment or a "I knew it but no big deal- no reason to mention it" from a professional seller of a multi thousand dollar instrument.

As I understand it you didn't buy this from the clueless widow of some geezer who kicked the bucket and left the instrument behind in the back room.

On a 1950 $750 Galanti Dominator I'd fix the rest, ensure the remaining celluloid was stable, emplace a back pad and play it. But it would still bug me to know the missing patch was there (personality driven in my case). (Black celluloid I would fill in- given the blue marble type it'd be more challenging)

The same thing on the Ouijaboard ought to be pretty darned nice accordion would truly cause me "aggravation and woe."

My commiserations and I'd almost surely send it back- something I have never been driven to do over seventy years of acquiring literally hundreds of accordions/sax's. flutes, trumpets,and clarinets- with the occasional tuba thrown in.

 

[OuijaBoard]

I did not unscrew, pull off, tear off, peel off, anything. The lower portion of backpads is often loose and unfixed, and this goes for the removable backpads with snaps. I've posted images of three upthread. Yes, I have now seen images of vintage, several-decades-old student-level and/or German/Czech accordions from the midcentury/60s/70s showing a nailed down panel in the upper 4/5 inches of the rear, kind of where the keyboard is. Someone posted a such an image upthread like that, of an old Hohner, possibly Czech/East German made, unknown. But even on those, the celloid from the bottom edge of these panels to the bellows, is intact. Unlike the image of what was sent to me.

I've seen a photo of a 30-year-old vintage Italian 26-key with one of those nailed on panels in the upper portion of the rear. The celluloid was intact below that one also. Unlike the $3,500 item shipped to me, which had a big chunk gauged out in the area above the bellows that is intact in all the photos I've seen of vintage accordions with a nailed-on panel kind of where the keyboard is. And the gauged-out area on the one sent to me was permeated with blue staining where there had been blue celluloid. It's in the original photos I posted upthread.

And in all contemporary PAs I've owned or seen including photos I've posted here of contemporary PAs---that goes for Italian, Weltmeister, and Chinese Hohner Bravos,, the entire rear of the accordion is intact, clean celluloid from the outer edge of the keyboard down to the bass-button panel. Either padless or with a removable snap-on pad. Anyone who thinks it would be great to pay several thousand dollars for a new accordion and see what is shown in my original post here, I know just where to send you to acquire that very thing.

It did ship out today. The whole thing has been very demoralizing. This is my first instrument return ever.

 

[Tom]

Have you received any response from Italy?

 

[OuijaBoard]

Have you received any response from Italy?

Nope. I will say that in my experience with other instruments (I dilettante around with a couple of acoustic stringed instruments at times), I've seen policies on dealer sites that all warranty or other issues go through them, not through the maker. I haven't looked at the fine print with this accordion dealer, beyond their own return policy. But perhaps that is a factor in the non-response from Italy. But I didn't make any demand of them, I just gave them an earful and attached photos. You'd think as a matter of pride and integrity they would wish to respond. But what do I know. It does induce cynicism about Ye Olde Castel-Fi.

 

[96Bass]

Has anyone ever received a supposedly brand-new accordion with a big square of celluloid cut out of the back with a razor? And naked wood showing? What passes for a back pad is a cheap piece of plastic-covered cardboard that was literally nailed and glued to the accordion, no snaps for removability. I can't tell how much of the celluloid is missing because the pad won't come off without damage. There clearly was celluloid there at one time because the naked area is stained with the color. I hope I attached the image correctly. I am in shock.

I bought a "new" accordion that was shipped from the city where the Liberty Bell is located. It arrived with significant damage to the outer case of the accordion. It had been on their display floor for quite some time and judging from the damage, my best guess is that it was dropped. They offered me some cash in case I wanted to have the accordion repaired locally. I returned the accordion and about a month later the accordion was back on their website, listed as "new", with no mention that the instrument had been damaged and repaired by them.
I'd guess that Ouigja obtained the accordion in question from the same place.

 

[JerryPH]

I have looked at all of my accordions after seeing this...not one shows a missing piece of celluloid.

 

[PhiliGol]

I have looked at all of my accordions after seeing this...not one shows a missing piece of celluloid.

OK, but you only have 16
Maybe we should ask @Rocko to inspect the 800 boxes he inherited from his father in law.