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Weltmeister Cantus V vs S5 Supita

oripoka7

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Hello everyone,

I noticed that a large majority of Macedonian or Bulgarian musicians today still play on Welmeister, because of the deap bass and of cours the typical cassotto color.

There are these 2 cassotto models that I have been coveting for a while, the Consona V and the S5 Supita, and I still have trouble noticing a real difference, both in appearance and sound. Price is also equal for 2nd hand.

Do you think there is a fundamental difference between these two models?

Thank you from France,
 
Hi,

Weltmeister Cantus V deluxe I have been playing since childhood. So to the point:

Model S5:
-is the predecessor of the Cantus model
-comes from the days when the manufacturer (Harmona, Klingenthal, Germany) designated models only by code and not by name. So: Model S5 is NOT Supita.
-inside are (Italian) tipo-a-mano reeds
-in the treble, the reed plates for the highest notes of the 4-register (H) are placed on two reed blocks from above (and not aside)

Cantus V model
-is a newer successor to the S5 model
-has two subtypes: Cantus V and Cantus V deluxe

A/ Cantus V
-has a German reeds "Sondermensur" (equivalent to "tipo-a mano")
-all 13 diskant (treble) registers are the same as in the case of the S5
-in the treble, the reed plates for the highest notes of the 4th register (H) are located on two reed blocks from above (and not from the side) - just like in the S5 model.
-mostly four-voice bass (sometimes five-voices)
-the deepest bass note is contra G (also G1)

B/ Cantus V deluxe
-has German reeds "Super Finish" (equivalent to "a mano")
in the 13 treble registers, one register (one switch) was adjusted (instead of the non-cassotto register M2 in S5 and Cantus V, there is a register M2M3H)
-all the reed plates in the treble reed blocks are placed sideways.
-the deepest bass note is contra E (also E1)
-there are usually 4 octaves in the bass (referred to from the deepest to the highest as 1, 2, 3, 4), sometimes a fifth octave is added.
-bass chords are two-voices, formed by the highest octaves 3 and 4 (sometimes with an added fifth octave)
-the instrument has 5 bass registers with the following arrangement of octaves: (3) – (3,2) – (4,3,2,1) – (4,3) – (3,2,1): applies to four-octeve basses (like my instrument) = most mass-produced instruments.
-weight ±12.6 kg (similar to S5 + CantusV models)

All models: S5 + Cantus V + Cantus V Deluxe
-all models have standard reed blocks in the basses (also: no Umlenkstimmstock, Winkelstimmstock, etc. - these are strictly retrofits)
-there are no holes in the bass cover (in the original design)
-extremely monumental and powerful bass (especially the V deluxe model)
-mostly asymmetric tremolo (M1=cassotto, M2 lower approx. -8 cents, M3 higher approx. +24 cents), but: watch out for tuning variability for different instruments (customer request or additional tuning adjustments)
-none of them are produced anymore
-accordion purchase: statistically you are more likely to find a preserved Cantus than a preserved S5 because the Cantus are newer.
-the tuning of these instruments tends to be very stable.
-body of the instrument made of beech wood, wooden reed blocks, no plastic or metal body.
-tuning: My personal remarkable finding: Instruments that have Italian voices (reeds) inside are mostly "kosher" tuned (valid mainly for S5). However, German reeds used to be machine pre-tuned already at the factory in a typical and visible way (reminiscent of a "sparing gentle Dremel" typical mostly both Cantus models). With these instruments, the use of this method of tuning is quite often seen even during spot tuning. Although a considerable number of Eastern European masters used this method of tuning sparingly, there are exceptions. Good advice: always look inside the instrument!

The possibilities of using the instrument(s) are huge and wide:
-the basic treble registers composed of the three basal voices of the sound pyramid (L, M – in cassotto + H) allow playing classical music, while the range of bass registers allows you to "simulate" even a freebass accordion on a limited range.
-very suitable for jazz
-amazing options for (French) musette music. Cantus V Deluxe includes registers: (M1M2M3) – (M2M3) – (M2M3H)
-"shallow" tremolo: Registers: (M1M2) and (M1M2H): suitable for transcriptions of string and symphonic music

My personal addendum:
-For almost all the musicians I have seen play, the possibilities of the instrument were much wider than their needs, requirements and in most cases their actual playing skills. If you're an Olympic champion in swimming 100 meters and even a huge Olympic swimming pool seems small to you, then you're looking for something bigger. The S5 or Cantus 5 is an ocean of possibilities for the accordionist.
-Since the instruments are not manufactured, my post is not a false advertisement. More photos, for example, here and here:

Best regards, Vladimir
 
Last edited:
Thank you so much Vladimir for this description that goes far beyond my expectations. It seems that the Cantus V model could be a safer choice for a 2nd hand instrument. Anyway, both models are indeed oversized for my actual skills and I should probably spend the reste of my life discovering their artistic possibilities. Sounds like a very good plan to me.
Thanks again!
 
Hello oripoka7,

I like your plan! I also know a man (I see him every morning in the mirror ;) ...), which from childhood until now (with time breaks) still reveals the possibilities of this instrument. You will not regret. I wish you all the best and good health.

Best regards, Vladimir
 
Oh, I feel like a young writer whose first work has been published:
So to the point: ...
I am normally pleased that an unknown American seller borrowed my words from my above post:
Cantus.jpg
But at least you all see that you (we) are being followed and read. And as the old joke says: anything you write can be used against you... :cool:

Best regards,
Vladimir
 
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