Glue question?

[debra]

FWIW,
Here's a pro at "Serenellini Accordions" making a set of bellows. His pot of glue is clearly visible in the frame from about 0.25 onwards.
The glue looks very similar to that shown in another in-factory video from another maker.

The only thing I'm seeing in this video is how they put the metal corners on bellows that were already made. There is also nothing that shows that this manufacturing process took place at Serenellini and I very much doubt that it was. Bellows are made in separate bellows factories, not in accordion factories.

 

[John Doe]

There's always the office stapler. The staples pull nicely with only a couple of small holes.

Available in stainless...

 

[KiwiSqueezer]

Having watched innumerable YouTube videos on accordion repair, it's clear there are a lot of cowboys out there. All but one of the video cowboys use PVA for bellows tape fixing: only one video mentions the need for a releasable adhesive to be used, but he gives no details. So I'm still trying to find a more responsible solution to bellows tape application than wood glue (PVA - and others). I re-read George Bachich's excellent material on the 'net. He stresses the use of a releasable adhesive, and claims that FRM Enterprises stock it, but I can't see it on their web site. Also, it seems that there's a high minimum order threshold. It feels like we're getting closer, but still frustratingly distant. Any ideas?

 

[Dingo40]

Another product:

Jade R Reversibe PVA Bookbinding Adhesive

Be advised that if this product freezes in transit, it will be rendered useless. Depending on your geographic location please take this into consideration when ordering. We will not refund orders that freeze in transit during winter months.Jade® R is a water reversible adhesive which is acid...

www.talasonline.com

 

[KiwiSqueezer]

Dingo40, thanks for keeping a look-out. Unfortunately, this PVA glue 'reverses' by the use of water - which would do bellows cardboard a power of no good.

What I believe we're looking for is something like the old glue that you might remember from school days, and was sold in conical bottles, with a red rubber applicator/spreader top, which was always gummed up with a thick layer of hardened and cracked glue. This glue was somewhat flexible, but failed by crumbling to powder, if deformed considerably, as would happen if a bellows tape were pulled back on itself. Only a crumbly, powdery residue was left on the substrate, which could be fairly easily removed by brushing off, or with a little gentle scraping. The stuff seems to have disappeared from the shelves, to be replaced by 'better' glues. However, 'better' depends on the application, doesn't it? Such is progress...

 

[Dingo40]

A last word on glue from me
Quite a number of aspiring bellows repairers mention the use of old fashioned "animal hide" glue (as used in joinery).
Some mention a "cold" variety and others particularise, specifying the hide of rabbits.
With the latter ( as in the case of the classic recipe for jugged hare) , first catch your rabbit!

 

[debra]

Having watched innumerable YouTube videos on accordion repair, it's clear there are a lot of cowboys out there. All but one of the video cowboys use PVA for bellows tape fixing: only one video mentions the need for a releasable adhesive to be used, but he gives no details. So I'm still trying to find a more responsible solution to bellows tape application than wood glue (PVA - and others). ...

I will look into getting book-binding glue. But so far I can be considered a "cowboy" who uses simple white glue. Typically when I have to replace bellows tape on an accordion (most often just the bottom and a bit on the back) the accordions are 50 years old. When the new tape lasts another 50 years the accordion will be in need of much more repair than just the bellows tape... What *is* really crucial is to not get the glue where you fold the tape as that has to flex while playing. I guess you need real book-binding glue in order to just put glue all over the tape.
Another tip on replacing bellows tape is to always replace tape by a wider tape so that any damage that might be visible (from the old tape removal) is covered by the new tape. Often accordions come with 18mm tape factory-installed. I replace it with 24mm tape. Looks good and covers enough.

 

[TimeSwan]

A little late to the conversation but I've done quite a few full retapings. Never a fun job but it sure makes bellows look fresh. I've had great luck using a pretty liberal amount of Elmer's Extra Strength Glue sticks. You'll go through quite a few sticks if you're doing the entire bellows but you can get a 48 pack for pretty cheap online.

Out of curiosity, has anyone found a decent alternative to bellows tape? I've been searching high and low through different craft stores (Hobby Lobby, Michaels, JoAnns etc) for something that might work as a substitute but I haven't had any luck. (also searching for grill cloth alternatives if anyone has any tips for that)

 

[debra]

Out of curiosity, has anyone found a decent alternative to bellows tape? I've been searching high and low through different craft stores (Hobby Lobby, Michaels, JoAnns etc) for something that might work as a substitute but I haven't had any luck. (also searching for grill cloth alternatives if anyone has any tips for that)

Why even look for an alternative to bellows tape? It is not very expensive, especially when you only use black. I bought one roll of black tape that will hopefully last me a decade or so. (I don't do that many complete bellows tape replacement as it's not all that fun.)

 

[tcabot]

It depends if you're doing a restoration of something really high end or just want a quick job to refresh a playable old box I guess.
For the latter, the price of "official" bellows tape might exceed the price you paid for the squeezebox itself .

I too am interested in affordable bellows tape alternatives. Some rubbery/painted paper strips should not be this expensive...
The Chinese bellows seem to have some rubbery stuff on them, but it makes a nasty clicking sound when you open the bellows.
Just like a Roland.

 

[Glug]

I've used glue from CGM Musical:

"bellow tape adhesive, 175 mls tub, as used by italian bellow makers"

bellows tape

What exactly that means you could ask Charlie.
I've done a couple of accordions with it and it's sticking just fine, but haven't tried to remove it yet.

He also sells damn fine bellows tape.

 

[Ventura]

high quality ribbon is available at your area wholesale Floral
products distributor (we have Potomac Floral here in the DMV)
and many styles are of a usable width, thickness and weave,
but, while the variety and colors available are legion,
it can be just as expensive as Bellows "tape" per inch

 

[debra]

It depends if you're doing a restoration of something really high end or just want a quick job to refresh a playable old box I guess.
For the latter, the price of "official" bellows tape might exceed the price you paid for the squeezebox itself .

I too am interested in affordable bellows tape alternatives. Some rubbery/painted paper strips should not be this expensive...
The Chinese bellows seem to have some rubbery stuff on them, but it makes a nasty clicking sound when you open the bellows.
Just like a Roland.

The bellows tape I use (24mm) costs about 20 euro for a role of 50 meters, which is more than enough for the complete bellows of two full size 5 voice accordions. So the tape for one accordion is about 10 euro. 19mm tape is about 2/3 of the price, just like it is about 2/3 of the width. Accordions are often made with 19mm tape, but when you replace it by 24mm tape you can hide blemishes where the edge of the old tape was.

 

[TimeSwan]

Debra, I don't only use black though. It's certainly the most common, but I often have to replace gold, silver, red, white or cream bellows tapes. Not to mention sometimes it's the ribbon/striped tape, sometimes its the flat/plain tape. Cost gets expensive really quick if I'm buying 10 or more different roles, and I wouldn't want to order as needed, then I'm paying for shipping multiple times. It would be much easier and cheaper for me if I had a local place I could drive to that carries something that is similar.

 

[tcabot]

UK bellows tape works out about 50 EUR per roll.

 

[debra]

Debra, I don't only use black though. It's certainly the most common, but I often have to replace gold, silver, red, white or cream bellows tapes. Not to mention sometimes it's the ribbon/striped tape, sometimes its the flat/plain tape. Cost gets expensive really quick if I'm buying 10 or more different roles, and I wouldn't want to order as needed, then I'm paying for shipping multiple times. It would be much easier and cheaper for me if I had a local place I could drive to that carries something that is similar.

I'm "member" of the "black accordions matter" movement, and virtually everyone who I'd be willing to service their accordion for has a black accordion with black bellows tape. I do have a black and cream colored Crucianelli (inherited from my sister) that had silver bellows tape with a black V-pattern (lots of small pieces of tape). I changed it to all-black tape and in my opinion it looks a lot better.
I understand the shipping cost issue. I can drive to Carini if needed, but it is 1500km (almost 1000 miles) each way. Shipping is cheaper.

 

[debra]

UK bellows tape works out about 50 EUR per roll.

Someone is making a huge profit here...

 

[tcabot]

Import charges + admin costs + harder to import some things + some EU vendors no longer deal with UK.
All the prices have gone up, regardless of whether you voted "yes" or "no" to brexit...

And yes, UK retailers have never been famous for reasonable commission %. In fact, I knew a couple of brick & mortar shops that were running 200-300% markups on some imported Chinese products (compared to identical stuff being sold online).