The smaller the accordion, the longer the straps

[xocd]

Today I had a duh moment; the smaller the instrument the longer the straps one needs.

I play sitting down with the weight of the accordion mostly on my legs; I use the straps to keep the instrument tightish to my chest. I was swapping around straps and "logically" installed the shorter straps on the smaller accordion, which resulted on the box hanging from my shoulders and not reaching my legs.

Realization: the smaller the instrument the longer the straps as the straps have to reach further down to the top of the instrument. This does not apply if you play standing up, of course.

I think I am going to research the wheel, or perhaps fire next.

 

[geoff45789]

Yes, it took me 2 years to work that out. Strangely, my smallest accordion has the shortest original straps. I suppose I'm meant to play it standing up

 

[debra]

Yes, it took me 2 years to work that out. Strangely, my smallest accordion has the shortest original straps. I suppose Im meant to play it standing up

The smaller accordions have shorter original straps because they are made for children.

When an adult plays with a smaller accordion you can think of the accordion + strap forming a loop. That loop should have more or less the same length no matter what the accordion is. The back of the accordion, from top strap hook to bottom strap hook is part of the loop. That part is a shorter distance on a small accordion so the strap then has to be longer to compensate.

 

[jozz]

I think I am going to research the wheel, or perhaps fire next.

have a nice weekend :ch

 

[Sebastian Bravo]

I remember i saw a guy playing a Hohner Concerto I and he was very tall and fat, and he used the original straps. Imagine that! he looked really funny with that small accordion. He really needed a 41/120 to compensate with his body.
The smaller the accordion, the smaller the player i think.

 

[Keymn]

I do not know if this has been the case with strap length or I am getting old (probably the latter). When I switched from fr7 to smaller fr4x I suddenly have my left rotor cuff sore. This was after I played over 30 gigs in October. I did minor strap adjustments (longer) seemed to help. But I think the damage was already done, maybe months to heal? I was standing on most gigs.

 

[jozz]

I do not know if this has been the case with strap length or I am getting old (probably the latter). When I switched from fr7 to smaller fr4x I suddenly have my left rotor cuff sore. This was after I played over 30 gigs in October. I did minor strap adjustments (longer) seemed to help. But I think the damage was already done, maybe months to heal? I was standing on most gigs.

I play standing as well, but this can happen to me even after the slightest over-loading / playing too long in one position (and Im 37). Most of the time it happens if I forget my backstrap. I use my nylon straps with those plastic buckles, to adjust them a lot in between, so that I can shift around the bad spots a bit.

 

[Dingo40]

I do not know if this has been the case with strap length or I am getting old (probably the latter). When I switched from fr7 to smaller fr4x I suddenly have my left rotor cuff sore. This was after I played over 30 gigs in October. I did minor strap adjustments (longer) seemed to help. But I think the damage was already done, maybe months to heal? I was standing on most gigs.

I play standing as well, but this can happen to me even after the slightest over-loading / playing too long in one position (and Im 37). Most of the time it happens if I forget my backstrap. I use my nylon straps with those plastic buckles, to adjust them a lot in between, so that I can shift around the bad spots a bit.

I find it helpful to keep the left elbow as far down and as close to the body as possible. I can then play for hours, daily, without issues<EMOJI seq=1f642>?</EMOJI>.

 

[george garside]

I use exactly the same strap setting on all my boxes. i.e. right strap longer than left to bring keyboard more or less under the chin so right arm is not flapping around in the wind. Then both straps aadjusted by same amount to bring the top of the treble end roughly a stretched handswidth below the chin when standing upright looking dead ahead ( like standing to attention.)

obviously the final setting needs to take into account individual anatomical shape and size but I find with these settings the large boxes 96/120 bass rest on knee to take some of the weight when seated and the smaller boxes don't - but then they don't need to as they are generally much lighter!

These settings also enable playing seated or standing without need for further adjustment

george

 

[JennyB]

I’ve found this a really interesting conversation, as I’ve now been learning for three years and am still finding it really hard to get the straps/seat height right for my 96 bass.

When I open the bellows I can feel my left shoulder straining against the strap. So I loosen off the strap, which drops the height of the accordion/puts the keyboard off vertical and means I can’t get to all the bass buttons. I do use a backstrap, incidentally. So I drop the height of my seat, my knees are raised a little and the top end of the keyboard becomes inaccessible. I’m talking here about playing exercises like the Hanson ones and also 2 octave scales, as most of the tunes I try really don’t use the extreme top end of the keyboard.

But to return to the position of the accordion, I’m thinking also there is maybe a rule of thumb as to where middle C should be relative to posture? Middle finger on middle C resulting in right arm at a right angle to the keyboard, maybe?

Perhaps changing to a 120 rather than a 96 would effectively lift the keyboard when the instrument rests on my lap, keeping it level but making buttons and keys more accessible?
Any thoughts from anyone on this conundrum?
Thanks!

 

[jozz]

in my study book the ideal posture is depicted as a person that has right thumb on lowest treble C, and lower arm is perfectly horizontal, while the keyboard is perfectly vertical

 

[maugein96]

I’ve found this a really interesting conversation, as I’ve now been learning for three years and am still finding it really hard to get the straps/seat height right for my 96 bass.

Jenny,

George Garsides advice about adjusting the right strap to be longer than the left seems to be universal, and is often not understood by people who are teaching themselves, which I assume you must be, as a teacher would have sorted out that out by now.

If you play seated with a 96 bass there is a good chance that you may have the accordion just a tad too high for comfort. If it is sitting too high (i.e. shoulder straps too tight) then you might just get away with that with a two voice treble instrument. Anything bigger and youll find it probably bounces around a bit, which will make bellows control and reaching those lower bass buttons a challenge.

Seated players of big 120 bass instruments usually end up with the top of the instrument just under their chins, and they dont have a lot of scope to change that unless their upper torso is particularly long. Having said that, the weight of the instrument tends to offer a degree of stability in operation that smaller instruments may not.

Try slackening off the shoulder straps just one hole at a time, until the instrument drops down nearer to your knees without actually touching them. At that point you should find that both of your arms seem to grow a couple of inches, and the blood supply to your fingers isnt getting cut off by being strapped in like a fighter pilot, whose controls are mostly all below his chest level. I cant help you with the c positions you refer to as Ive never played a PA, but I can tell you that a missile aimer in a jet aircraft cannot function if his elbows are consistently lower than his fingertips.(There werent any female aircrew when I was in the military.)

Playing with a backstrap while seated (for me) tends to bring the instrument so close to my chest that it will throw the accordion further out and away from my comfortable reach, rendering those low bass buttons as being nothing more than ornaments. Also, beware of the bass strap being too tight, as that is also a source of issues with reaching the higher and lower bass notes. Slacken it off so that you can slide between both extremes of the upper and lower bass button rows without your wrist fouling on the strap, but dont have it so loose that you cant control the bellows.

Basically, you need to be able to make full use of your instrument throughout its entire range. If you are getting too high or too low for comfort something isnt right. Ive seen professional players play with one (right) shoulder strap only, and even no shoulder straps with the instrument sitting on their lap.

Try and adopt the principle that if there is scope for variation then try to experiment. If there is no scope for variation then just try to adapt.

Watch You Tube videos and youll see that there is more than one way to do most things. If you end up playing upside down then Ill guarantee somebody will have done it before you.

Heres a clip of Michel Pruvot, one of the most famous French contemporary accordeonistes. This is the most comfortable playing position for him with 96 bass. If any of your ancestors were from Picardy and their arms were longer than their legs this set-up might suit you, or not as the case may be. Dont get bogged down with the finer points. Just play and enjoy!.

 

[jozz]

:mrgreen:

"Both straps should be tightened to keep the instrument tight to the body. The left strap is shorter (ca. 10 cm), in order to get the keyboard vertically straight below the chin."

and then:

"SIT STRAIGHT UND NATURAL!"

 

[maugein96]

Jozz,

That photo is probably a lot more use than my long winded post.

I keep forgetting that most people don't play CBAs, which tend to be more compact than their PA counterparts. That's a pretty big instrument for a 2 voice 72 bass (to we CBA types).

 

[JennyB]

Thanks very much indeed for suggestions, which have been very helpful. I actually unbuckled all the straps and started again, working on the premise that right strap was markedly longer than left and the instrument did not have to be four inches below my chin (read that somewhere).
Right strap is now quite a lot longer than the left, and both straps are much longer than before (though not yet in Pruvo's league - how does he do it??). Also the back strap is longer, and the result is much more comfortable and better access. Still not perfect, but I think its going to take some tweaking over time to arrive at the best setup for me.
So thank you again, and happy playing
Best wishes

 

[maugein96]

Thanks very much indeed for suggestions, which have been very helpful. I actually unbuckled all the straps and started again, working on the premise that right strap was markedly longer than left and the instrument did not have to be four inches below my chin (read that somewhere).
Right strap is now quite a lot longer than the left, and both straps are much longer than before (though not yet in Pruvos league - how does he do it??). Also the back strap is longer, and the result is much more comfortable and better access. Still not perfect, but I think its going to take some tweaking over time to arrive at the best setup for me.
So thank you again, and happy playing
Best wishes

Jenny,

Just when you get it all sorted out youll get another accordion and it will all start over again!

Some of us have quite a few instruments and some are more comfortable than others. Most French players used to play seated until about the 50s when Andre Verchuren started to incorporate a dance routine while playing. Ive no idea how Pruvot can play like that. He must have exceptionally long arms.

My arms are on the short side so I couldnt even consider it.